CW
cwathen
Founding member
All my TVs are 4:3 (and long may that remain the case). Ideally, I would watch 4:3 material in 4:3 (obviously!) and widescreen in 14:9 compromise mode. For a while when I had a Goodmans GDB3 DTT box which support 14:9 that wasn't a problem.
Now that I don't have that option any more, I watched analogue 1-5 in order to get 14:9 and on other channels I choose between 4:3 centre cut and 16:9 letterbox on a programme-by-programme basis (usually settling on 4:3 centre cut unless the picture is being cropped particularly badly)
Now that I don't have that option any more, I watched analogue 1-5 in order to get 14:9 and on other channels I choose between 4:3 centre cut and 16:9 letterbox on a programme-by-programme basis (usually settling on 4:3 centre cut unless the picture is being cropped particularly badly)
HA
I still don't understand why Sly boxes can't do 14:9 at all because my multi-sat receiver does do this, as I tuned into BBC News 24 and I watched it in 14:9, so it is possible.
harshy
Founding member
cwathen posted:
All my TVs are 4:3 (and long may that remain the case). Ideally, I would watch 4:3 material in 4:3 (obviously!) and widescreen in 14:9 compromise mode. For a while when I had a Goodmans GDB3 DTT box which support 14:9 that wasn't a problem.
Now that I don't have that option any more, I watched analogue 1-5 in order to get 14:9 and on other channels I choose between 4:3 centre cut and 16:9 letterbox on a programme-by-programme basis (usually settling on 4:3 centre cut unless the picture is being cropped particularly badly)
Now that I don't have that option any more, I watched analogue 1-5 in order to get 14:9 and on other channels I choose between 4:3 centre cut and 16:9 letterbox on a programme-by-programme basis (usually settling on 4:3 centre cut unless the picture is being cropped particularly badly)
I still don't understand why Sly boxes can't do 14:9 at all because my multi-sat receiver does do this, as I tuned into BBC News 24 and I watched it in 14:9, so it is possible.
EI
That's because the majority of the public doesn't give a toss. Most people are quite happy to zoom 4:3 material to fill the screen. They've paid for a wide screen, they want it filled. The only way to avoid it is for manufacturers to remove the facility for owners to adjust aspect ratios manually.
You could explain the difference between 4:3 and 16:9 until you were blue in the face and it wouldn't change matters. My advice is to relax and let other people do what they want with their TVs. I used to get wound up about it myself, but eventually I got tired of explaining to people how to use their TV properly, and then going round later and noting that they'd gone back to zooming 4:3 material to fill the screen.
james2001 posted:
Many people just seem to think widescreen is the normal picture stretched out. No-one is prepared to give them the technical details which has lead to this situation
That's because the majority of the public doesn't give a toss. Most people are quite happy to zoom 4:3 material to fill the screen. They've paid for a wide screen, they want it filled. The only way to avoid it is for manufacturers to remove the facility for owners to adjust aspect ratios manually.
You could explain the difference between 4:3 and 16:9 until you were blue in the face and it wouldn't change matters. My advice is to relax and let other people do what they want with their TVs. I used to get wound up about it myself, but eventually I got tired of explaining to people how to use their TV properly, and then going round later and noting that they'd gone back to zooming 4:3 material to fill the screen.
BB
On my digibox I have feeding my 4:3 14" TV I have it set to 16:9 squashyvision (ie. my 4:3 TV is displaying a proper picture intended for 16:9 TVs).
This is because I can't be arsed with changing the settings everytime I want to record something on the computer from the TV (I have a VCR but it's mono and on its last legs). I had it on 4:3 centre cut out until recently but ITVs butchering of archive 4:3 material to 16:9 really made me sick of seeing a slightly fuzzy faux 4:3 picture and so I just stuck it on 16:9 stretchyvision and left it at that.
I can't stand watching in letterbox. I can probably live with watching 4:3 pillarbox/16:9 stretchyvision if I ever get a widescreen TV.
This is because I can't be arsed with changing the settings everytime I want to record something on the computer from the TV (I have a VCR but it's mono and on its last legs). I had it on 4:3 centre cut out until recently but ITVs butchering of archive 4:3 material to 16:9 really made me sick of seeing a slightly fuzzy faux 4:3 picture and so I just stuck it on 16:9 stretchyvision and left it at that.
I can't stand watching in letterbox. I can probably live with watching 4:3 pillarbox/16:9 stretchyvision if I ever get a widescreen TV.
BI
That's because the majority of the public doesn't give a toss. Most people are quite happy to zoom 4:3 material to fill the screen. They've paid for a wide screen, they want it filled. The only way to avoid it is for manufacturers to remove the facility for owners to adjust aspect ratios manually.
You could explain the difference between 4:3 and 16:9 until you were blue in the face and it wouldn't change matters. My advice is to relax and let other people do what they want with their TVs. I used to get wound up about it myself, but eventually I got tired of explaining to people how to use their TV properly, and then going round later and noting that they'd gone back to zooming 4:3 material to fill the screen.
But as was said in the original post, most of the public don't even know how to watch widescreen material properly either. They leave the digital box set to 4:3 cut-out and stretch that to fill the screen! Not even the BBC (who bang on about widescreen so often) are letting viewiers know that their digital box has a function for different aspect ratios. Most viewers are unaware and jsut leave it as defualt (4:3 cut-out).
Edward Ington-Lock posted:
james2001 posted:
Many people just seem to think widescreen is the normal picture stretched out. No-one is prepared to give them the technical details which has lead to this situation
That's because the majority of the public doesn't give a toss. Most people are quite happy to zoom 4:3 material to fill the screen. They've paid for a wide screen, they want it filled. The only way to avoid it is for manufacturers to remove the facility for owners to adjust aspect ratios manually.
You could explain the difference between 4:3 and 16:9 until you were blue in the face and it wouldn't change matters. My advice is to relax and let other people do what they want with their TVs. I used to get wound up about it myself, but eventually I got tired of explaining to people how to use their TV properly, and then going round later and noting that they'd gone back to zooming 4:3 material to fill the screen.
But as was said in the original post, most of the public don't even know how to watch widescreen material properly either. They leave the digital box set to 4:3 cut-out and stretch that to fill the screen! Not even the BBC (who bang on about widescreen so often) are letting viewiers know that their digital box has a function for different aspect ratios. Most viewers are unaware and jsut leave it as defualt (4:3 cut-out).
SP
Ideally I'd like to watch 16:9 programmes in 16:9 and 4:3 programmes in 4:3 (pillarbox) as they were meant to be.
The big problem though is that so many digital channels such as those from UKTV and Flextech annoyingly insist on showing 16:9 material in 14:9 letterbox - the result being that if your TV's set to pillarbox 4:3 the actual picture ends up with black bars at both the top and sides.
As a less-than-ideal compromise I therefore tend to watch 4:3 and 14:9 programmes in the TV's 'Super Live' mode which fills the screen, but loses a bit at the top and bottom (including the 14:9 black bars). It also distorts the picture slightly so stuff in the middle of the screen looks less stretched.
If I was getting a new TV however, I'd make sure it had an auto-zoom function which would lose any black bars automatically.
The big problem though is that so many digital channels such as those from UKTV and Flextech annoyingly insist on showing 16:9 material in 14:9 letterbox - the result being that if your TV's set to pillarbox 4:3 the actual picture ends up with black bars at both the top and sides.
As a less-than-ideal compromise I therefore tend to watch 4:3 and 14:9 programmes in the TV's 'Super Live' mode which fills the screen, but loses a bit at the top and bottom (including the 14:9 black bars). It also distorts the picture slightly so stuff in the middle of the screen looks less stretched.
If I was getting a new TV however, I'd make sure it had an auto-zoom function which would lose any black bars automatically.
NU
14:9 is the way forward. Watching it in true 4:3 is all very well and good for the purists, but there's so much wasted space. Any distortion of the picture just makes you look like a complete idiot.
My TV has a "4:3 default" menu setting; so when there's not a 16:9 signal present it will default to that. I can choose any of the supported aspect modes for this setting. However my dad has just bought a new widescreen telly (Toshiba I think) and the available options for this setting are either 4:3 (black bar tastic) or "Super Live" (zooms in a bit and strecthes the edges), even though the TV has several other widescreen modes (including 14:9) that you can select manually. It's very frustrating and it would always be the first thing I check when buying a new TV. I don't want to be faffing around with the aspect mode every bloody time I change channel.
As for the UKTV_XXX channels, I could use this as another oppurtunity to say that they should be showing programmes in the format they were made in but I wont!
My TV has a "4:3 default" menu setting; so when there's not a 16:9 signal present it will default to that. I can choose any of the supported aspect modes for this setting. However my dad has just bought a new widescreen telly (Toshiba I think) and the available options for this setting are either 4:3 (black bar tastic) or "Super Live" (zooms in a bit and strecthes the edges), even though the TV has several other widescreen modes (including 14:9) that you can select manually. It's very frustrating and it would always be the first thing I check when buying a new TV. I don't want to be faffing around with the aspect mode every bloody time I change channel.
As for the UKTV_XXX channels, I could use this as another oppurtunity to say that they should be showing programmes in the format they were made in but I wont!
MU
I've only got a 4:3 tv. My box stays in 16:9 mode most of the time for taping purposes, but if I'm just watching a programme I usually flick to 16:9 letterbox just till the programme ends. If I had a 16:9 option on my tv, I'd use that and leave the box alone. I don't mind black top and bottom bars on my 4:3 tv when watching 16:9 stuff, and I wouldn't mind black side bars on a wide tv when watching 4:3 stuff.
I hate it when they force you to watch 4:3 within a 16:9 frame by broadcasting it that way (like BBC4 and CBBC do sometimes), it means I have to manually set my box up in 4:3 cutout, spoiling any tape I'm making of the programme and annoying me in general. It also lowers the quality of the picture. Broadcasters should just shove everything out with the signal to tell the tv which mode to go into, and leave it at that.
I hate it when they force you to watch 4:3 within a 16:9 frame by broadcasting it that way (like BBC4 and CBBC do sometimes), it means I have to manually set my box up in 4:3 cutout, spoiling any tape I'm making of the programme and annoying me in general. It also lowers the quality of the picture. Broadcasters should just shove everything out with the signal to tell the tv which mode to go into, and leave it at that.
JH
They do, but not on analogue. If you get a widescreen set, it's easy just to leave your box in 16:9 and then let the television switch between 4:3 or widescreen.
mulder posted:
I don't mind black top and bottom bars on my 4:3 tv when watching 16:9 stuff, and I wouldn't mind black side bars on a wide tv when watching 4:3 stuff. Broadcasters should just shove everything out with the signal to tell the tv which mode to go into, and leave it at that.
They do, but not on analogue. If you get a widescreen set, it's easy just to leave your box in 16:9 and then let the television switch between 4:3 or widescreen.