UKTV channels set to leave Virgin Media on Sunday

I called them on Monday - said I wanted to leave because of the loss of the UKTV channels and quoted the prices Sky had offered me (having rang them first), but made it clear I didn’t really want the hassle of changing provider, but I really wanted those channels. The guy was excellent - said I could leave with no penalty (even though 13 months left on my contract) but if I stayed he could give me a £6 reduction on my bill for 18 months and a £50 credit (to buy a Firestick or similar to allow me to get those channels). He also said that negotiations were still underway and the channels may be back soon. Well, I was happy enough to accept the discount and credit, and will probably get a Firestick as I was thinking about getting one anyway.

I now have the Firestick/Android/Roku dilemma - and I’m a complete newbie to such devices - but that’s a conversation for elsewhere!

Of course, if ITV3 goes and the Corrie repeats aren’t on the ITV Player that will be a bugger!

You won't be able to get those channels on a Firestick, at least legally anyway, due to device restrictions on the TVPlayer platform.

Correct! They've been telling customers porkies just to keep them on.

Knowing Virgin they'll probably think That's TV would be an adequate replacement. The scary thought is it's probably the second biggest commercial local network in the UK.

Same. I've got a Freesat PVR gathering dust as the LNB on the house is knackered (the dish was there when I moved in) - I've been using it in the bedroom to get catchup players on the non-smart TV in there but I've put my old BT Youview box in there now as I couldn't get All4 on Freesat.

Do Liberty Global - owners of VirginMedia - still have a 10% stake in ITV?

Just checked, yeah, only modern episodes on the Hub, not the ITV3 repeat run.

I very much doubt a 10% stake would be enough to have any real effect.

I believe that makes it the largest single shareholder in ITV though.

There's a rumour that Liberty Global are considering a bid for ITV again soon. They've recently sold a load of companies in mainland Europe to Vodafone "in order to focus on their UK & Ireland businesses". The sale has given them a load of cash to play with.

That would be one way to solve the dispute

(By the way, Liberty Global also own 50% of All3Media... the other 50% owned by their friends at Discovery)

Just to explain the background to the ITV dispute...

Until recently, cable companies (going back to the 1980s) were allowed to retransmit public service channels without having a proper carriage agreement. Essentially they were allowed to relay existing transmissions for free. It was a deliberate loophole in the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, effectively saying it was still the broadcaster's signal, so there was no breach of copyright. The reason for the loophole was to help encourage investment in the cable TV industry more than 30 years ago, but it has long been exploited by the likes of TVCatchup and similar services.

For a while now, ITV have lobbied to close that loophole, arguing that Virgin Media is exploiting their content with things like Tivo where people can fast forward adverts, therefore leaving ITV without a revenue stream. In 2017 the loophole was closed and Virgin is effectively breaking copyright laws for retransmitting ITV's content without paying for it.

Most people in the industry were expecting ITV could make anything up to £40m thanks to the change in the law.

In mid 2017 ITV demanded Virgin pay them £80m a year or else remove ITV from the platform.

So as you can imagine, relations are... fractious to say the least.

Virgin Media said it would go to Ofcom and invoke a "must carry" agreement which still stands, but it would still mean Virgin is breaking copyright laws if ITV aren't properly recompensed. It is believed if Virgin went to Ofcom, it would end up with the Culture Secretary having to mediate and decide how much ITV should get.

So with neither party really having the appetite for that, I believe ITV is now renegotiating the carriage of all its channels, including ITV, and while they won't get £80m for ITV, they may end up charging a lot extra for ITV2 etc, and making a lot more money.

It's believed they were close to an agreement, but following the UKTV fallout, ITV have sent a shirty letter to Virgin threatening to take its channels down if the agreement isn't signed by the end of the week.

That's basically where we're at now.

Virgin will suffer more than ITV - because while we dont have an Aerial I imagine the majority do. Sky will also benefit because if ITV channels go as well customers will go because what channels could be next.
I believe the Media show had a poll saying 43% of Virgin customers are considering leaving - and that wouldn't have taken into account reports that ITV channels could be in danger.

By the way, the change in the law means all other PSBs can charge too, including the BBC. It's unlikely that the BBC would ever consider it for obvious reasons, but Channel 4 offered support to ITV's lobbying of the law change.