TW
Is it only me who finds the idea of a watershed for swear words a bit bizarre? Why is it that you can't say f*ck during the day, but once it ticks over to 9PM then you only need to warn of impending strong language and it's then fine?
People who find swearing offensive will do so whether the language is used in the middle of the afternoon or late at night. Similarly, people who have no problem with it will not care what time of day such language is used.
The traditional answer of course is to 'protect the children'. Aswell as finding the idea of the kiddiewinkles being safely tucked up in bed by 9PM a little bit laughable, what exactly are they being protected from? Words they allready use?
I'm not suggesting that we should start seeing the 9 O'Clock f*cking news or songs of s**ting praise, but surely it's time the idea of a cutoff time was dropped, and the decision as to whether or not swearing is allowed is based on the likelihood of the target audience to be offended by it or not.
I find this attitude to strong language quite bizarre. 'Childrens' programmes like Grange Hill are allowed to depict underage sex, incest, drug abuse, alcohol abuse, physical abuse, sexual abuse, etc etc in much higher proportions than generally happen in a secondary school, but yet the characters are still confined to telling each other to 'naff off' and sort their 'flipping' life out etc - even though virtually all of it's target audience wouldn't find use of strong language offensive, and would probably respect it more for it's realism.
'Ah but you shouldn't have swearing on Coronation Street. It's family viewing which the small children who shouldn't be exposed to such words might be watching', I hear some people shout. Excuse me? 'Family viewing'? Because swearing is not allowed? Despite the content of the storylines it's 'family viewing' is it? People who use the absence or not of swearing as their only benchmark for a given programme being suitable or not for watching with their children have a very blinkered view of selecting suitable programmes.
As I said above, I think a rethink needs to happen. The present situation of a watershed makes no sense except in the minds of the 'outraged of Warrington' type people who write in to Points of View.
Believe it or not, a hell of a lot of people can't stand the use of swear words on televison. Sure, the majority of those wouldn't mind the odd use of 'bloody' or 'crap' and, as a consequence, these words or phrases are used in small proportions occasionally before the watershed. However, a constant 'sh*t' or 'f*ck' is deemed unacceptable by many; I myself also saw that Hard-Fi programme round at my sister's over the weekend, and she hated the way that certain words were repeatedly used.
I think it's the fact that before 9pm, people can be comfortable with the fact that this is relatively 'safe' viewing, regardless of whether children are around or not, and after this time swearing can be expected. I guess the 9pm watershed is there as a kind of legislation in a way; broadcasters have the right to air profanities after this time, regardless of whether viewers favour the use of language or not, and therefore any strong language can be justified - before this time however, it can not.
cwathen posted:
Quote:
Hmm.. It's fairly subjective as to whether those words would cause offence or not.
Broadcasters do take this kind of thing seriously, and before a programme's broadcast, someone will view it all the way through and make a note of any bad language (or anything else that might breach Ofcom's Broadcast Code) - they might make a pre-watershed version of it and cut bits out, or bleep or dip the audio around sweary bits.
Broadcasters do take this kind of thing seriously, and before a programme's broadcast, someone will view it all the way through and make a note of any bad language (or anything else that might breach Ofcom's Broadcast Code) - they might make a pre-watershed version of it and cut bits out, or bleep or dip the audio around sweary bits.
Is it only me who finds the idea of a watershed for swear words a bit bizarre? Why is it that you can't say f*ck during the day, but once it ticks over to 9PM then you only need to warn of impending strong language and it's then fine?
People who find swearing offensive will do so whether the language is used in the middle of the afternoon or late at night. Similarly, people who have no problem with it will not care what time of day such language is used.
The traditional answer of course is to 'protect the children'. Aswell as finding the idea of the kiddiewinkles being safely tucked up in bed by 9PM a little bit laughable, what exactly are they being protected from? Words they allready use?
I'm not suggesting that we should start seeing the 9 O'Clock f*cking news or songs of s**ting praise, but surely it's time the idea of a cutoff time was dropped, and the decision as to whether or not swearing is allowed is based on the likelihood of the target audience to be offended by it or not.
I find this attitude to strong language quite bizarre. 'Childrens' programmes like Grange Hill are allowed to depict underage sex, incest, drug abuse, alcohol abuse, physical abuse, sexual abuse, etc etc in much higher proportions than generally happen in a secondary school, but yet the characters are still confined to telling each other to 'naff off' and sort their 'flipping' life out etc - even though virtually all of it's target audience wouldn't find use of strong language offensive, and would probably respect it more for it's realism.
'Ah but you shouldn't have swearing on Coronation Street. It's family viewing which the small children who shouldn't be exposed to such words might be watching', I hear some people shout. Excuse me? 'Family viewing'? Because swearing is not allowed? Despite the content of the storylines it's 'family viewing' is it? People who use the absence or not of swearing as their only benchmark for a given programme being suitable or not for watching with their children have a very blinkered view of selecting suitable programmes.
As I said above, I think a rethink needs to happen. The present situation of a watershed makes no sense except in the minds of the 'outraged of Warrington' type people who write in to Points of View.
Believe it or not, a hell of a lot of people can't stand the use of swear words on televison. Sure, the majority of those wouldn't mind the odd use of 'bloody' or 'crap' and, as a consequence, these words or phrases are used in small proportions occasionally before the watershed. However, a constant 'sh*t' or 'f*ck' is deemed unacceptable by many; I myself also saw that Hard-Fi programme round at my sister's over the weekend, and she hated the way that certain words were repeatedly used.
I think it's the fact that before 9pm, people can be comfortable with the fact that this is relatively 'safe' viewing, regardless of whether children are around or not, and after this time swearing can be expected. I guess the 9pm watershed is there as a kind of legislation in a way; broadcasters have the right to air profanities after this time, regardless of whether viewers favour the use of language or not, and therefore any strong language can be justified - before this time however, it can not.
:-(
A former member
f**k is often bleeped out on Fwiday Night With Jonathan Woss, shown at 10:35pm on BBC1, and he often does use that word on the show.
OH
ohwhatanight
Founding member
Even Sir Trevor Mcdonald was bleeped on tonight's Have I Got News For You saying f**k after the 9pm watershed!
DI
(WARNING: Vague sleepy post ahead!)
I'm sure I heard someone say "sh*t" on yesterday's "Come Dine With Me", which was on at 3pm.
And I recall Dermot O'Leary only being allowed "four craps" on an 11-am-ish BBLB.
I'm sure I heard someone say "sh*t" on yesterday's "Come Dine With Me", which was on at 3pm.
And I recall Dermot O'Leary only being allowed "four craps" on an 11-am-ish BBLB.
AM
Because b.l.o.o.dy in Australia isn't really a swearword, it's like saying fliping heck.
Even the new Australian Tourist board advert ends with "So where the bloody hell are you?!"!!
The UK censors actually banned the advert from TV for a while!!!! - I was in Cuba and it was big news on CNN during first week in March. SO SILLY BY OUR CENSORS!!!!!
Now that would be a good snippet to use of C4's "Banned in the UK" series
benjy posted:
dbl posted:
DJ Dave posted:
Well Neighbours is always saying b.l.o.o.d.y nearly everyday.
Because b.l.o.o.dy in Australia isn't really a swearword, it's like saying fliping heck.
Even the new Australian Tourist board advert ends with "So where the bloody hell are you?!"!!
The UK censors actually banned the advert from TV for a while!!!! - I was in Cuba and it was big news on CNN during first week in March. SO SILLY BY OUR CENSORS!!!!!
Now that would be a good snippet to use of C4's "Banned in the UK" series
NJ
It will do, as its just timeshifted. I've never seen output on a timeshift channel altered because of something that happened on the main channel as I don't think it would be worth the effort. It's probably the main reason why you keep seeing "this competition is not open to E4+1 viewers" all over E4 Music.
Neil Jones
Founding member
sjdavis posted:
There were plenty of f**ks on the Hard-Fi concert on E4 over the Easter Holiday at 10am in the morning - it was repetitive. There was an on-screen apology, but they obviously couldn't be bothered to adjust E4+1 - as that carried the same f**ks!
It will do, as its just timeshifted. I've never seen output on a timeshift channel altered because of something that happened on the main channel as I don't think it would be worth the effort. It's probably the main reason why you keep seeing "this competition is not open to E4+1 viewers" all over E4 Music.
MI
Heard a Sh!t on that decorate-an-entire-street program pre-9pm yesterday.
American Pie 2 is heavily edited when shown on ITV2 after 9pm - doesnt make sense. Anyone choosing to watch American Pie isn't going to be offended by anything.
Cr a p, bl.o.o.dy, b.u.g.g.e.r and s.o.d. are all perfectly acceptable pre-9pm IMHO. Fcuk, bo11ocks, sh!t, c u nt post 9pm un-bleeped.
American Pie 2 is heavily edited when shown on ITV2 after 9pm - doesnt make sense. Anyone choosing to watch American Pie isn't going to be offended by anything.
Cr a p, bl.o.o.dy, b.u.g.g.e.r and s.o.d. are all perfectly acceptable pre-9pm IMHO. Fcuk, bo11ocks, sh!t, c u nt post 9pm un-bleeped.
CW
Indeed, that's my point. I'm not saying that I personally want to see a wholesale increase in use of strong language on TV, I'm just making the observation that people who don't like swearing (either generally or on TV) still won't like it no matter what time of day it happens. Yet other people find swearing acceptable, so it's become acceptable to feature limited swearing on TV. But why legislate an acceptable use policy that is based on time? Time seems the most bizarre thing in the world to use as a yardstick - I'm not aware of anyone who would turn their nose up in disgust at swearing at one time of the day yet be quite happy with it at another.
This is my other point - that viewing is judged to be 'safe' based mainly on whether or not it features swearing. It seems bizarre to me that many of the storylines which feature on primetime 'family soaps' are anything but 'safe' viewing, yet just because the script uses clean language it enjoys unrestricted transmission.
Yes that's the rule, but why? There is no way you can justify swearing on TV some of the time but ban it at others based on the time of day that the programme happens to be scheduled.
The bizarreness of the watershed is demonstrated no better than when a programme (usually a film) crosses the watershed. It starts at 8PM and is edited to hell because it's before 9PM. At 9PM the channel goes to the news and the CA returns at 9:30 warning that the remainder of the film contains strong language. So an audience is 'protected' from swearing for one half of the film yet 'exposed' to it for the other. Where is the logic in that? It's one film, one item in the schedule, one audience. It should therefore be presented in one way - either edited throughout or not edited at all. Why should it be partially edited just because it happens to be scheduled over an arbitrary cut off point for swearing?
I'm not arguing for the lowering of standards on TV - I do believe that there should still be controls on use of language on TV, but whether or not something is transmitted before or after 9PM is a stupid way of doing it, we might have become conditioned to accepting the 9 O'Clock watershed, but IMO upon close examination it shows itself to be nothing other than an ineffective and pointless way of controlling language use.
I don't think it's quite as clear cut as nothing before 9, but anything goes after - there are still additional tiers of regulation, but as far as I'm aware the only defined times are at 9PM when things can go a bit ripe, and 5:30AM when everything must become nice and pure.
cwathen
Founding member
Quote:
Believe it or not, a hell of a lot of people can't stand the use of swear words on televison. Sure, the majority of those wouldn't mind the odd use of 'bloody' or 'crap' and, as a consequence, these words or phrases are used in small proportions occasionally before the watershed. However, a constant 'sh*t' or 'f*ck' is deemed unacceptable by many; I myself also saw that Hard-Fi programme round at my sister's over the weekend, and she hated the way that certain words were repeatedly used.
Indeed, that's my point. I'm not saying that I personally want to see a wholesale increase in use of strong language on TV, I'm just making the observation that people who don't like swearing (either generally or on TV) still won't like it no matter what time of day it happens. Yet other people find swearing acceptable, so it's become acceptable to feature limited swearing on TV. But why legislate an acceptable use policy that is based on time? Time seems the most bizarre thing in the world to use as a yardstick - I'm not aware of anyone who would turn their nose up in disgust at swearing at one time of the day yet be quite happy with it at another.
Quote:
I think it's the fact that before 9pm, people can be comfortable with the fact that this is relatively 'safe' viewing, regardless of whether children are around or not, and after this time swearing can be expected. I guess the 9pm watershed is there as a kind of legislation in a way;
This is my other point - that viewing is judged to be 'safe' based mainly on whether or not it features swearing. It seems bizarre to me that many of the storylines which feature on primetime 'family soaps' are anything but 'safe' viewing, yet just because the script uses clean language it enjoys unrestricted transmission.
Quote:
broadcasters have the right to air profanities after this time, regardless of whether viewers favour the use of language or not, and therefore any strong language can be justified - before this time however, it can not.
Yes that's the rule, but why? There is no way you can justify swearing on TV some of the time but ban it at others based on the time of day that the programme happens to be scheduled.
The bizarreness of the watershed is demonstrated no better than when a programme (usually a film) crosses the watershed. It starts at 8PM and is edited to hell because it's before 9PM. At 9PM the channel goes to the news and the CA returns at 9:30 warning that the remainder of the film contains strong language. So an audience is 'protected' from swearing for one half of the film yet 'exposed' to it for the other. Where is the logic in that? It's one film, one item in the schedule, one audience. It should therefore be presented in one way - either edited throughout or not edited at all. Why should it be partially edited just because it happens to be scheduled over an arbitrary cut off point for swearing?
I'm not arguing for the lowering of standards on TV - I do believe that there should still be controls on use of language on TV, but whether or not something is transmitted before or after 9PM is a stupid way of doing it, we might have become conditioned to accepting the 9 O'Clock watershed, but IMO upon close examination it shows itself to be nothing other than an ineffective and pointless way of controlling language use.
Quote:
I though F*** and C*** couldn't be used on TV until around 11/1130pm and only until abou 430am
I don't think it's quite as clear cut as nothing before 9, but anything goes after - there are still additional tiers of regulation, but as far as I'm aware the only defined times are at 9PM when things can go a bit ripe, and 5:30AM when everything must become nice and pure.