HE
No it's not like RTE because RTE was never part of the BBC to begin with, so didn't become a spin-off. Read the SNP's plans for the SBC, then you'll understand. If the SNP spends all of the licence fee on Scottish programming, then as I outlined earlier, that leaves £0 on imports. And if you add advertising to try and fund some imports then by it's very nature the SBC will be fundamentally different from the BBC. There of course is another interesting issue, the knock-on effect of an SBC on the remaining BBC. It's a 10% (licence fee) budget cut effectively, and while most of that will be absorbed by the savings of BBC Scotland disappearing, there will be still some budget custs required at the BBC to make up the difference. And one final point... if SNP want an SBC but then don't really want it to be completely different from the BBC... why bother setting up the SBC in the first place? They'd be better lobbying for more Scottish programmes on the BBC.
smgboi posted:
I don't think you realise how little it would change. Rather like a commercial operation, senior management would change and that would be about it! Some programmes would be lost but, like RTE, many would still be there!! They could also subsidise the fee with advertising too, like RTE!
No it's not like RTE because RTE was never part of the BBC to begin with, so didn't become a spin-off. Read the SNP's plans for the SBC, then you'll understand. If the SNP spends all of the licence fee on Scottish programming, then as I outlined earlier, that leaves £0 on imports. And if you add advertising to try and fund some imports then by it's very nature the SBC will be fundamentally different from the BBC. There of course is another interesting issue, the knock-on effect of an SBC on the remaining BBC. It's a 10% (licence fee) budget cut effectively, and while most of that will be absorbed by the savings of BBC Scotland disappearing, there will be still some budget custs required at the BBC to make up the difference. And one final point... if SNP want an SBC but then don't really want it to be completely different from the BBC... why bother setting up the SBC in the first place? They'd be better lobbying for more Scottish programmes on the BBC.
:-(
A former member
I couldn't give a rat arese about A scottish Six,
what else could BBC scotland do in Reginal programming that we have not alrealdy seen:
we dont NOT need a another Scottish soap, nor scottish cooking show, Nor a Scottish hoilday show,
what else could BBC scotland do in Reginal programming that we have not alrealdy seen:
we dont NOT need a another Scottish soap, nor scottish cooking show, Nor a Scottish hoilday show,
TV
I don't understand how the Scottish think they can survive without English taxpayers. We subsidise their hospitals, education system etc and dont get anything back in return! Now they want our television progorammes for free also, if they get independence.
To be frank, I think they should be independent, and get rid of the tax burden for the English.
To be frank, I think they should be independent, and get rid of the tax burden for the English.
:-(
A former member
what about all the OIL tax Mr brown Get;s???
AB
Before I get started... I'm talking purely about the desirability or not of an "SBC" here. Don't read anything into this about my views on the wider issue of Scottish independence or who I'd like to see win the election.
The BBC, for all its faults, has made an immeasurable contribution to life in Scotland over the past 84 years. The SNP's plan for an SBC seems to be based on the same economic argument that they use when they're talking about oil revenues. While it's true that BBC Scotland's own budget is less than the amount raised from Scottish licence fees, it completely ignores the fact that Scots also enjoy network programming.
Radio Scotland is not BBC Radio in Scotland - Radio 1, Radio 2, Radio 4 and Five Live all have substantial audiences here. Together they dwarf Radio Scotland in popularity. Radio 3 may not have a big audience but the BBC Scottish Symphony Orchestra is one of its bedrocks.
As for the effect on television, I shudder. A licence fee to pay for a service which also carries adverts? And where the independent SBC has to buy in the programmes it needs to fill a schedule from the BBC or elsewhere at market rates.
So the independent SBC struggles to maintain the current range of BBC Scotland opt-out programming and is deprived of the right to make programmes for BBC Network? Why would London ever spend licence payers' money on programmes from the SBC or independent producers here? When did you last see an RTE Production on BBC1?
In fairness, you could imagine a compromise where the BBC channels were still broadcast, even on Freeview. But as people here would not actually be paying for them, the BBC in London would be perfectly entitled to ignore them and simply treat Scots as an overspill audience. Just like the situation in Southern Ireland or the Netherlands. It really would become the English Broadcasting Corporation.
The idea of an SBC is based on the mistaken premise that the BBC is part of the British state - not an organisation which helps bring people across Scotland, Wales, England and Northern Ireland together. Indeed Margo Macdonald, who's no longer in the SNP of course, once described the BBC as the perfect example of the kind of co-operation between Scotland and England which could be a role model after independence.
Another point. Does anyone seriously think an independent SBC would be in the process of moving to Europe's most advanced broadcasting centre? Like RTE in the nineties, it would probably still be showing the Phillips test card until lunchtime.... with a loop of endless Scottish country dance music!
The BBC, for all its faults, has made an immeasurable contribution to life in Scotland over the past 84 years. The SNP's plan for an SBC seems to be based on the same economic argument that they use when they're talking about oil revenues. While it's true that BBC Scotland's own budget is less than the amount raised from Scottish licence fees, it completely ignores the fact that Scots also enjoy network programming.
Radio Scotland is not BBC Radio in Scotland - Radio 1, Radio 2, Radio 4 and Five Live all have substantial audiences here. Together they dwarf Radio Scotland in popularity. Radio 3 may not have a big audience but the BBC Scottish Symphony Orchestra is one of its bedrocks.
As for the effect on television, I shudder. A licence fee to pay for a service which also carries adverts? And where the independent SBC has to buy in the programmes it needs to fill a schedule from the BBC or elsewhere at market rates.
So the independent SBC struggles to maintain the current range of BBC Scotland opt-out programming and is deprived of the right to make programmes for BBC Network? Why would London ever spend licence payers' money on programmes from the SBC or independent producers here? When did you last see an RTE Production on BBC1?
In fairness, you could imagine a compromise where the BBC channels were still broadcast, even on Freeview. But as people here would not actually be paying for them, the BBC in London would be perfectly entitled to ignore them and simply treat Scots as an overspill audience. Just like the situation in Southern Ireland or the Netherlands. It really would become the English Broadcasting Corporation.
The idea of an SBC is based on the mistaken premise that the BBC is part of the British state - not an organisation which helps bring people across Scotland, Wales, England and Northern Ireland together. Indeed Margo Macdonald, who's no longer in the SNP of course, once described the BBC as the perfect example of the kind of co-operation between Scotland and England which could be a role model after independence.
Another point. Does anyone seriously think an independent SBC would be in the process of moving to Europe's most advanced broadcasting centre? Like RTE in the nineties, it would probably still be showing the Phillips test card until lunchtime.... with a loop of endless Scottish country dance music!
:-(
A former member
aberdeenboy posted:
, it would probably still be showing the Phillips test card until lunchtime.... with a loop of endless Scottish country dance music!
your selling the idea to me!!! I woudl rather have this instead of the cheap Daytime programmes!
AB
Kristian Digby or the Phillips test card? Maybe there is something to be said for the SBC afterall! 
HR
To put another spin on this, what is there to say that 'English' services would be available to the Scottish population? Everybody, including the increasingly slimey and smarmy Salmond (and his high priestess Sturgeon) seem to expect that if Scottish independence takes place, that Scotland would be entitiled to enter into a period of negotiation, in order to equate to a fair split. As I remeber from school, the actual rights to disolve the United Kingdom rests with Westminster (not Holyrood) and so, there is nothing to stop an English parliament either revoking devolution or simply cutting Scotland free. As for oil, it would be a simple matter to redesignate the North Sea as English, and by offering financial inducements, the oil industry simply upsticks from Aberdeen to the North East - Scotland would not be able to afford the changes.
As for television, the BBC Scotland situation is laughable. Popular programmes are shifted around the schedule to incorporate some lame excuses in drama (River Ciry) and the local (National) news output extends for such a huge area, that no detailed coverage can be given. Interested in sport? Forget it, unless you like golf or support the likes of Celtic or Rangers - effectively nowhere else exists.
STV is desperately trying to put out a service, but in reality it knows that it must merge with ITV if it is to survive. Lack of network programming is a problem (despite the huge success of Taggart and Rebus) and local programmes seem to be restricted to pap and gaelic, for which considerable amounts of money seem to be expended for a small audience. However, if the SNP get their way, we may be forced down the Welsh path of having to be bilingual.
The election is now only two weeks away, and the opinion polls have become conspicuous by their absence. The key here is the Lib Dems - even more suspicious than Salmond, they hold the keys. At the end of the day, they don't want independence and as the SSP and Scottish Greens will either self distuct (SSP) or be of little benefit to the SNP, I don't think we should be shouting panic just yet.
aberdeenboy posted:
It might be useful for some of the people reading to get an explanation of the current position in Scotland and the process which could potentially lead to independence. You hear so much nonsense from people - north and south of the border - who think it would happen days after an SNP election victory!!
Here's the potential process.
1 The SNP becomes the single largest party in the Scottish Parliament next month. With a PR system there's no realistic chance of them having a majority - and with the current arithmetic it's virtually impossible the SNP and the minor parties which also back independence will have a majority. (eg the Greens, Solidarity.)
2 The Liberal Democrats agree to a coalition deal with the SNP - but are forced to accept a referendum of independence as part of the package. (The Lib Dems say they won't do this but that's an argument for another place. It's not inconceivable they may accept a referendum as long as they have the right to campaign for a No vote. Another option may be a multi-option referendum with more devolution also a choice)
3 A referendum is held in 2010 as promised by the SNP - with Labour, the Lib Dems and the Conservatives all campaigning vigorously for a No vote along with most of the popular press. However, a Yes vote is still achieved. (The result is by no means certain. Opinion polls on independence vary widely - I suspect this is because a lot of people don't know the difference between independence and further devolution.)
As for the effect on broadcasting, the SNP's current policy is to create a Scottish Broadcasting Corporation which would, in effect, be a Scottish version of RTE.
This would, in effect, mean the main BBC tv and radio services would be replaced in Scotland - even if the SBC and the BBC maintained a close working relationship. There was a very interesting article on SNP broadcasting in the Sunday Herald a few weeks back - apologies for not having a link.
However the impact on commercial broadcasters is likely to be minimal. The links between STV and ITV Network are commercial ones - and the SNP recognise how difficult commercially it might be to actually force STV to increase Scottish output though they certainly would not complain if STV did.
I don't think there's even a suggestion of trying to interfere with C4 or five let alone the channels with no pretence of being public services.
I hate to say this, but the possibility of Scots being deprived of favourite BBC programmes would probably be quite an effective campaigning tool for unionists in the run up to any referendum. You can just imagine the headlines in the Daily Record. ("Doctor Who Faces Extermination After Independence". "Strictly No Dancing - Brucie To Disappear in Independent Scotland" etc etc etc)
To be honest I suspect many nationalists realise how unpopular this would be and, whatever their policy may be just now, they would probably leave the BBC alone in return for a Scottish Six - plus a Scottish One and Ten!!!
Here's the potential process.
1 The SNP becomes the single largest party in the Scottish Parliament next month. With a PR system there's no realistic chance of them having a majority - and with the current arithmetic it's virtually impossible the SNP and the minor parties which also back independence will have a majority. (eg the Greens, Solidarity.)
2 The Liberal Democrats agree to a coalition deal with the SNP - but are forced to accept a referendum of independence as part of the package. (The Lib Dems say they won't do this but that's an argument for another place. It's not inconceivable they may accept a referendum as long as they have the right to campaign for a No vote. Another option may be a multi-option referendum with more devolution also a choice)
3 A referendum is held in 2010 as promised by the SNP - with Labour, the Lib Dems and the Conservatives all campaigning vigorously for a No vote along with most of the popular press. However, a Yes vote is still achieved. (The result is by no means certain. Opinion polls on independence vary widely - I suspect this is because a lot of people don't know the difference between independence and further devolution.)
As for the effect on broadcasting, the SNP's current policy is to create a Scottish Broadcasting Corporation which would, in effect, be a Scottish version of RTE.
This would, in effect, mean the main BBC tv and radio services would be replaced in Scotland - even if the SBC and the BBC maintained a close working relationship. There was a very interesting article on SNP broadcasting in the Sunday Herald a few weeks back - apologies for not having a link.
However the impact on commercial broadcasters is likely to be minimal. The links between STV and ITV Network are commercial ones - and the SNP recognise how difficult commercially it might be to actually force STV to increase Scottish output though they certainly would not complain if STV did.
I don't think there's even a suggestion of trying to interfere with C4 or five let alone the channels with no pretence of being public services.
I hate to say this, but the possibility of Scots being deprived of favourite BBC programmes would probably be quite an effective campaigning tool for unionists in the run up to any referendum. You can just imagine the headlines in the Daily Record. ("Doctor Who Faces Extermination After Independence". "Strictly No Dancing - Brucie To Disappear in Independent Scotland" etc etc etc)
To be honest I suspect many nationalists realise how unpopular this would be and, whatever their policy may be just now, they would probably leave the BBC alone in return for a Scottish Six - plus a Scottish One and Ten!!!
To put another spin on this, what is there to say that 'English' services would be available to the Scottish population? Everybody, including the increasingly slimey and smarmy Salmond (and his high priestess Sturgeon) seem to expect that if Scottish independence takes place, that Scotland would be entitiled to enter into a period of negotiation, in order to equate to a fair split. As I remeber from school, the actual rights to disolve the United Kingdom rests with Westminster (not Holyrood) and so, there is nothing to stop an English parliament either revoking devolution or simply cutting Scotland free. As for oil, it would be a simple matter to redesignate the North Sea as English, and by offering financial inducements, the oil industry simply upsticks from Aberdeen to the North East - Scotland would not be able to afford the changes.
As for television, the BBC Scotland situation is laughable. Popular programmes are shifted around the schedule to incorporate some lame excuses in drama (River Ciry) and the local (National) news output extends for such a huge area, that no detailed coverage can be given. Interested in sport? Forget it, unless you like golf or support the likes of Celtic or Rangers - effectively nowhere else exists.
STV is desperately trying to put out a service, but in reality it knows that it must merge with ITV if it is to survive. Lack of network programming is a problem (despite the huge success of Taggart and Rebus) and local programmes seem to be restricted to pap and gaelic, for which considerable amounts of money seem to be expended for a small audience. However, if the SNP get their way, we may be forced down the Welsh path of having to be bilingual.
The election is now only two weeks away, and the opinion polls have become conspicuous by their absence. The key here is the Lib Dems - even more suspicious than Salmond, they hold the keys. At the end of the day, they don't want independence and as the SSP and Scottish Greens will either self distuct (SSP) or be of little benefit to the SNP, I don't think we should be shouting panic just yet.
RM
High Road finished up after the Queen Mum died. Some believe it was only being made for her!
As Gavin states, there is no High Road anymore. However, you will be able to see Joe McFadden (Gary McDonald ), as the new lead policeman in Heartbeat, from the end of this year.
Sorry to go OT, but what is happening to Jonathan Kerrigan (PC Rob Walker) then
john04 posted:
Gavin Scott posted:
miss hellfire posted:
We have this topic on metropol and MP24/7 version is way more fun than this one. We have Sea-monsters, trolls, Kilts and Welsh cornish pasties to discuss over there. Mind you we haven't discussed to Scots programmes. Is take the high road still going? Will us English lot still get to see Taggart?
High Road finished up after the Queen Mum died. Some believe it was only being made for her!
As Gavin states, there is no High Road anymore. However, you will be able to see Joe McFadden (Gary McDonald ), as the new lead policeman in Heartbeat, from the end of this year.
Sorry to go OT, but what is happening to Jonathan Kerrigan (PC Rob Walker) then
:-(
A former member
the Last Good STV programme was Weirs way!