NG
So maybe it's not a fair technical comparison but he is comparing like-for-like given that they are both forms of domestic TV transmissions. If Joe Public goes out and buys a massive 69" Plamsa telly only to discover that when he gets it home the allegedly soon-to-be-turned-off analogue picture looks better than digital then he's not really going to care that if they used the full bandwitdh it would look good.
There's a lot of talk about this HDTV satellite, but what channels are actually going to be on it?!
Yep - as broadcast UK MPEG2 may be worse than UK PAL - but in other countries the PAL broadcasts will look massively worse than our MPEG2, and MPEG2 in other countries beats our PAL... I agree that the artefacts on PAL transmissions are less objectionable to many than those on UK MPEG2 - and UK MPEG2 could look better - but that is not what Mark wrote.
On the other hand an off-air PAL signal fed into a 60" plasma will also look pretty awful. The subcarrier artefacts will be huge - as will the cross colour effects - and even with high-end decoders (which many plasmas don't employ because they are designed more for RGB/Component feeds) the pictures still look pretty awful. The major problem with modern plasmas and 100Hz TVs and digital broadcasts is that the cheap interlace->progressive or field doubling processing used is very poor quality - and adds artefacts of its own to the received picture. There are very few plasmas that will display a 625/50 picture as cleanly as a CRT based system - believe me I've looked at a lot - from 32" to 61" models from the major manufacturers...
As for EuroHD carrying "channels" - it isn't like that - it will be offering two channels of its own. The Main channel - which will be FTA - and the Event channel - which will be encrypted. The Main channel will show 4 hours of material a day, repeated 3 times. The Event channel will not be a subscription channel as such - instead it will be used to broadcast events to specific locations who will be authorised to decrypt the broadcasts.
The Main channel will mainly broadcast programme that are being recorded by broadcasters in HDTV for archive / sale purposes - such as opera, ballet, music concerts etc. Sport is a possibility if rights issues are sorted. The BBC certainly shoot most of their high-end classical music (apart from the Barbican stuff) on HDTV these days. The Last Night of the Proms has been HD for a few years (Japanese broadcasters pay for the HD bit I think) - as are many major classical concerts shot by European PSBs. It is less likely that films and drama will be shown - as there is much less HD drama production by PSBs in Europe - and I doubt EuroHD will be able to sort film deals with Hollywood! The USP for this channel initially will be the quality rather than the content I fear...
Given that high-end plasmas and projectors sold in Europe are already HDTV ready, and show up the compression artefacts of SDTV digital transmissions, there may be a small (but big enough) market within the home cinema community.
The Event channel run by Euro1080 will be available to event producers who wish to make their events available to a wider audience than can attend a venue in person. eCinemas and Pubs/Clubs will be able to be authorised to decrypt the Event channel to show live pop-concerts etc. to their customers. This is happening already - a David Bowie concert was shown across Europe in eCinemas recently. (Though not via Euro1080 AIUI)
What you won't get on Euro1080 is an HDTV SkyOne, or an HDTV BBC Four...
noggin
Founding member
The Nurse posted:
noggin posted:
I think that you aren't fairly comparing like with like.
So maybe it's not a fair technical comparison but he is comparing like-for-like given that they are both forms of domestic TV transmissions. If Joe Public goes out and buys a massive 69" Plamsa telly only to discover that when he gets it home the allegedly soon-to-be-turned-off analogue picture looks better than digital then he's not really going to care that if they used the full bandwitdh it would look good.
There's a lot of talk about this HDTV satellite, but what channels are actually going to be on it?!
Yep - as broadcast UK MPEG2 may be worse than UK PAL - but in other countries the PAL broadcasts will look massively worse than our MPEG2, and MPEG2 in other countries beats our PAL... I agree that the artefacts on PAL transmissions are less objectionable to many than those on UK MPEG2 - and UK MPEG2 could look better - but that is not what Mark wrote.
On the other hand an off-air PAL signal fed into a 60" plasma will also look pretty awful. The subcarrier artefacts will be huge - as will the cross colour effects - and even with high-end decoders (which many plasmas don't employ because they are designed more for RGB/Component feeds) the pictures still look pretty awful. The major problem with modern plasmas and 100Hz TVs and digital broadcasts is that the cheap interlace->progressive or field doubling processing used is very poor quality - and adds artefacts of its own to the received picture. There are very few plasmas that will display a 625/50 picture as cleanly as a CRT based system - believe me I've looked at a lot - from 32" to 61" models from the major manufacturers...
As for EuroHD carrying "channels" - it isn't like that - it will be offering two channels of its own. The Main channel - which will be FTA - and the Event channel - which will be encrypted. The Main channel will show 4 hours of material a day, repeated 3 times. The Event channel will not be a subscription channel as such - instead it will be used to broadcast events to specific locations who will be authorised to decrypt the broadcasts.
The Main channel will mainly broadcast programme that are being recorded by broadcasters in HDTV for archive / sale purposes - such as opera, ballet, music concerts etc. Sport is a possibility if rights issues are sorted. The BBC certainly shoot most of their high-end classical music (apart from the Barbican stuff) on HDTV these days. The Last Night of the Proms has been HD for a few years (Japanese broadcasters pay for the HD bit I think) - as are many major classical concerts shot by European PSBs. It is less likely that films and drama will be shown - as there is much less HD drama production by PSBs in Europe - and I doubt EuroHD will be able to sort film deals with Hollywood! The USP for this channel initially will be the quality rather than the content I fear...
Given that high-end plasmas and projectors sold in Europe are already HDTV ready, and show up the compression artefacts of SDTV digital transmissions, there may be a small (but big enough) market within the home cinema community.
The Event channel run by Euro1080 will be available to event producers who wish to make their events available to a wider audience than can attend a venue in person. eCinemas and Pubs/Clubs will be able to be authorised to decrypt the Event channel to show live pop-concerts etc. to their customers. This is happening already - a David Bowie concert was shown across Europe in eCinemas recently. (Though not via Euro1080 AIUI)
What you won't get on Euro1080 is an HDTV SkyOne, or an HDTV BBC Four...
