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Meridian and London DSO

(February 2012)

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MA
Markymark
Interesting. I suspect the logical conclusion to all this long term (10 to 15 years) will be to ditch all terrestrial digital broacasting, both DAB (on the ropes anyway) and DVB-T. Deliver TV and radio services via the internet, be that fibre to the home, or 4G, 5G etc wireless service etc.

It's only 'data' at the end of the day.

But it's very inefficent that way - why send out lots of little streams to everyone individually when you can just send them simultaneously to everyone from the top of a hill or a satellite? Even though everything's gradually moving to on demand, there will always still be some linear broadcasting

It would take 10-15 years or maybe even longer to make such a transition - the mobile networks at present are nowhere near up to the task and there's many parts of the country with bad fixed line internet


No, but there seems an unstoppable culture to replace the UHF broadcast bands, with 'non broadcast' usage.
That usage for the 800 MHz band is 4G services, I can see where this is leading !

If they're going to keep reducing the spectrum available for broadcasting in the conventional sense, what alternative is there ?
TJ
TedJrr
.......but there seems an unstoppable culture to replace the UHF broadcast bands, with 'non broadcast' usage. ..That usage for the 800 MHz band is 4G services, I can see where this is leading

If they're going to keep reducing the spectrum available for broadcasting in the conventional sense, what alternative is there ?


The is a bit of an assumption that at some point traditional domestic broadcast will harmonise with network delivered services, by a combination of wireless and brodband/FTTH (fibre-to-the-home). How fair this assumption is has to be really debatable. One factor that needs to be considered is how broadcast can justify continued allocation of multiple 8Mhz UHF channels to broadcast 6 multiplexes, at least 4 of which could have been constructed as SFNs to conserve bandwidth.

Part of the problem is that broadcast engineers are very conservative, this characterises the strategic politics around broadcast engineering and frequency planning. Telecommunications engineers have tended to adapt into a culture where they have met the information technology world. Here, everything is not conservative; and anyway they think globally, whereas broadcasters think by ITU region.

Broadcast planners are comfortable with the regulatory process surrounding their allocations, but the shift in culture will mean that if there is a big scrap between the wireless network and broadcast worlds, then broadcast will lose. And badly.
IS
Inspector Sands
I'm sure, in common with just about ever other transmitter that has DSO'd, some folk will upload to You Tube the analogue channels going off. It's not terribly exciting in most cases, one moment sound and pictures, the next noise and snow.

Indeed, here's one from last night's switch off at Hannington:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_RZPkUGHuZI
MA
Markymark
I'm sure, in common with just about ever other transmitter that has DSO'd, some folk will upload to You Tube the analogue channels going off. It's not terribly exciting in most cases, one moment sound and pictures, the next noise and snow.

Indeed, here's one from last night's switch off at Hannington:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_RZPkUGHuZI


Very good Smile

BBC South were usless this morning. Reporting that "later today Hannington analogue would be shut down, and viewers would receive pop up notices asking them to retune" . Over the top of pictures of Rowridge, but other than that 100% accurate reporting ! No wonder the punters are confused by DSO, when the BBC can't get basic facts about themselves correct.

Better than Meridian I suppose (or maybe not !), who said nothing !

By the way, watching our brand spanking new HD mux, and ITV Meridian HD, there was one hell of a nasty splat opting in and out of Daybreak. Took the codecs about a second to stabilise on each opt point. Don't know what happened on SD ?
OV
Orry Verducci
By the way, watching our brand spanking new HD mux, and ITV Meridian HD, there was one hell of a nasty splat opting in and out of Daybreak. Took the codecs about a second to stabilise on each opt point. Don't know what happened on SD ?

Daybreak has done that for about a year now on Meridian HD, and I assume other HD regions as well. Strange given that it didn't do that when Daybreak first launched, and you would've though they'd have done something about it by now.
NW
nwtv2003
By the way, watching our brand spanking new HD mux, and ITV Meridian HD, there was one hell of a nasty splat opting in and out of Daybreak. Took the codecs about a second to stabilise on each opt point. Don't know what happened on SD ?

Daybreak has done that for about a year now on Meridian HD, and I assume other HD regions as well. Strange given that it didn't do that when Daybreak first launched, and you would've though they'd have done something about it by now.


Daybreak doesn't really like Granada HD either (on Virgin Media), when ITV1 goes into a regional programme then you usually get the last second of ITV1 SD with no blips, but I have no idea why when handing over to the Regional news during Daybreak the picture jumps. Although GMTV was SD there were never any issues like that.
NG
noggin Founding member
Are there more ITV HD regions on DTT than DSat? (Presumably they all have to get back hauled to the BBC Coding and Mux operation to get them statmuxed onto Mux B / PSB 3? I wonder if the opt-switching happens at Technicolor in Chiswick?)
MA
Markymark
Are there more ITV HD regions on DTT than DSat? (Presumably they all have to get back hauled to the BBC Coding and Mux operation to get them statmuxed onto Mux B / PSB 3? I wonder if the opt-switching happens at Technicolor in Chiswick?)


I'm not sure there are at present. It was with some dismay that I discovered the version we've been given on Hannington DTT, is the Meridian Kent/E Sussex one. I believe that's the same version that's on D-Sat (encrypted so only on 'Sky' D-Sat ?)

I think in other DTT areas, you don't necessarily get the right sub region, or even region ?
TT
Tumble Tower
BBC South were usless this morning. Reporting that "later today Hannington analogue would be shut down, and viewers would receive pop up notices asking them to retune" . Over the top of pictures of Rowridge, but other than that 100% accurate reporting ! No wonder the punters are confused by DSO, when the BBC can't get basic facts about themselves correct.

Did South Today say anything Tuesday or Wednesday evening about Hannington DSO? If they did, was it possible to limit it to Hannington transmitter group, with Rowridge etc showing something else, or did the whole South Today area regardless of transmitter group get it?

For comparison, the night before DSO stage 2 on the Mendip transmitter group, Points West showed separate instructions on BBC1 West analogue and BBC1 West digital for what to do on DSO Stage 2 day Wednesday 7 April 2010. That Wednesday evening they had another DSO related report.

The critical difference is, Points West area switched all in one go as it had only one transmitter group - Mendip. South Today is different, it has several transmitter groups, and Hannington was the first of its transmitter groups to go digital only.
MA
Markymark
BBC South were usless this morning. Reporting that "later today Hannington analogue would be shut down, and viewers would receive pop up notices asking them to retune" . Over the top of pictures of Rowridge, but other than that 100% accurate reporting ! No wonder the punters are confused by DSO, when the BBC can't get basic facts about themselves correct.

Did South Today say anything Tuesday or Wednesday evening about Hannington DSO? If they did, was it possible to limit it to Hannington transmitter group, with Rowridge etc showing something else, or did the whole South Today area regardless of transmitter group get it?

For comparison, the night before DSO stage 2 on the Mendip transmitter group, Points West showed separate instructions on BBC1 West analogue and BBC1 West digital for what to do on DSO Stage 2 day Wednesday 7 April 2010. That Wednesday evening they had another DSO related report.

The critical difference is, Points West area switched all in one go as it had only one transmitter group - Mendip. South Today is different, it has several transmitter groups, and Hannington was the first of its transmitter groups to go digital only.


No mention at all on South Today on Weds night (or Tuesday). They have no way to easily separte Hannington off, it was off air fed from Rowridge for analogue, and is fed from the same DTT codecs as Rowridge for DTT.

South Today could however do a DTT/analouge split on Rowridge, once Midhurst has switched on March 14th. However, the DTT side would also be seen on Midhurst and Hannington.

As you point out, much easier for Points West and Mendip, (and I saw the digital version, and thought it was very good)

12 days later

ME
meridiantvfan
Just over 24 hours now until BBC 2 goes off air from Rowridge and all relays, is there a delay with this say a second or two ?

ie the moment Rowridge goes WhiteHawk Hill goes at exactly the same time ?

Shame BBC South Today or Meridian can't be bothered to film it Sad
IS
Inspector Sands
Just over 24 hours now until BBC 2 goes off air from Rowridge and all relays, is there a delay with this say a second or two ?
ie the moment Rowridge goes WhiteHawk Hill goes at exactly the same time ?

A relay does exactly what it's name suggests - it just re-broadcasts what it's parent does. As soon as Rowridge turns off there'll be nothing to feed the relays and they will go off too.

I don't think Whitehawk is a relay of Rowridge, at least not on all channels. Certainly on Digital UK they're treating it as a separate transmitter group. Incidently, Midhurst, also in the Meridian area had stage 1 last week


Quote:
Shame BBC South Today or Meridian can't be bothered to film it Sad

What makes you think they won't? Rowridge is the 'big one' for their region

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