Does the BBC need a re-brand?

They should change the idents but not the BBC logo itself. BBC 3 now looks the worst out of all of the channels , the only reason I'm thinking this is basically BBC 3 is the BBC version of E4 and they are trying to target 'younger' audiences , to me the idents are stale looking now and should look modern , but they're just not!

What position and points are you referring to?

IMO the BBC logo is fine and looks professional in black, white or even greyscale, however it's only recently the BBC has started to use other colours, take the shocking pink they used for some Olympic trailers.

I think as much as BBC One, BBC Two, and BBC Four are in desperate need of a fresh new look. I do think its time to update the playout equipment and bring in more interesting and dynamic programme junctions, and informational graphic sequences.

Channel 4, Channel 5, and now ITV have interesting junctions which help the structure of the channel feel modern and fresh. I know they are a public service, and people will criticise any spending they do, but they need it.

I agree with Martin when it comes to playout equipment, however I do think BBC One is in need of a rebrand, after nearly 7 years of this tripe with some edits I've got to say it makes the whole channel feel dated and old, it's even more surprising that the design in use is very 2006! It's not moved with the times.

BBC Two I just won't get started on or I'll never stop! BBC Three needs a rebrand without a doubt, it's hideous!

The playout contract with Red Bee only has a couple more years to run - perhaps the retendering process will throw up some more interesting ideas.

What makes the BBC1 idents feel dated to me isn't the design, it's the fact that I have the launch of that logo on VHS!

It might not look good for the BBC to spend money on presentation at the moment. It's too politically sensitive. However as ITV have just rebranded, it could be an excuse to freshen up.

I've always thought the BBC logo was a strong brand, but it probably needs someone like Lambie Nairn to come in and give its implementation a refresh.

The logo is a very strong brand, but the BBC's presentation is definitely in need of a shake-up. It looks very dated compared to it's commercial rivals.

Hey even my username has had a rebrand...

On the BBC logo itself - I still think it is perfectly fine, and has stood the test of time. The channels, however...

Exactly right - there just needs to be sufficiently strong concepts behind all of the identities. BBC1 lacks any great strength. BBC 2 has stepped backwards and been damaged somewhat. I don't think they can afford to let their channels fall any further.

Even though BBC 1 arguably just pulled off the edit-based refresh to the idents, the gains were short-lived. BBC 4 is marginally the most stale on account of years in use by this point - however its idents sort of sit there quietly and (comparatively) understated... So I actually don't think they grate anywhere as much as some of BBC 1's sequences do, after as many plays as now.

BBC 2's cancelled refresh over a few years ago - an ill-judged 'phase two' for the look - was always going to be doomed because the ideas that were lined up were fairly terrible. It's looking tired now, but frankly was mistreated more than it ever should have been.

BBC 3 is not mentioned - but IMO that's probably the one with the weakest idea and execution visually... I've never liked it. Not as stale, but I just think a couple of those idents look plain messy. It's the use of CG to create entire scenes that just don't look good in CG. Some of BBC 2's 2001 sequences looked better - but then the simplicity of the scenes meant they were both easier on rendering, and looked more clean, more 'ident-like' by a mile. So there's nothing wrong with using computers, they can be vital sometimes - they just don't always work for creating certain complex pieces.

There is also a recent worrying trend of promo designers in the BBC not knowing the correct logos or typefaces, particularly on some network BBC 2 output.

In an ideal world I would have to say, maybe consult someone like Martin Lambie-Nairn, and carefully lay plans for a rebrand of all four main BBC channels, a la ITV in terms of roll-out - as well as re-installing the practice of ensuring logos, icons and typefaces are kept consistent and correct across BBC output into the future. It would take time to do all of this - but to really get it right, I think it would have to. Next best option could perhaps be to rebrand BBC 1 & 2 identities considering some of their stronger previous attributes (not exactly 'back to basics', but sort of) and developing the new look from there.

In the real world, I'd do the exact opposite of what TV forum says, the forum is not exactly in touch with popular opinion.

Oddly enough, I hated the BBC logo when it launched, I thought it was boring compared to what came before. However its since become a design classic. To put things in context when comparing with ITV, when it launched ITV were still using the 1989 logo. They're now on their fourth logo since. Shows you the strength of the BBC brand compared with ITV.