NG
I endorse what you say there, sticking ANYTHING on ITV2 back in November 2004 or November 2005 was a recipe for disaster, as a lot of people still didn't have any form of digital then. If they'd put the FA Cup Final on ITV2 at the time there wouldn't have been many viewers. They should have kept it on ITV1, which everyone could get.
But the show tanked on ITV1 - so it would have been commercial suicide to show it on the main terrestrial network and lose the ad revenue that would result... I think ITV hoped that they would get ratings as good as the main Eurovision Song Contest, but the show was nowhere near as compelling to watch, and the ratings reflected that. They realised it was a bit of a turkey in UK terms, so relegated it to ITV2 and dropped out of hosting.
Would ITV seriously schedule JESC rather than The X Factor this weekend??
(It's interesting to note that, like Britain, it is often the "second string EBU" broadcasters who are involved - ITV in the UK (when they were), TV4 not SVT in Sweden etc. I think SVT, NRK and DR pulled out to run a Nordic show - RUV and YLE may also be involved as they weren't happy with the pressure of the big show?)
noggin
Founding member
Presumably on the basis it doesn't attract a big enough audience on ITV1 so what chance do smaller channels have.
I endorse what you say there, sticking ANYTHING on ITV2 back in November 2004 or November 2005 was a recipe for disaster, as a lot of people still didn't have any form of digital then. If they'd put the FA Cup Final on ITV2 at the time there wouldn't have been many viewers. They should have kept it on ITV1, which everyone could get.
But the show tanked on ITV1 - so it would have been commercial suicide to show it on the main terrestrial network and lose the ad revenue that would result... I think ITV hoped that they would get ratings as good as the main Eurovision Song Contest, but the show was nowhere near as compelling to watch, and the ratings reflected that. They realised it was a bit of a turkey in UK terms, so relegated it to ITV2 and dropped out of hosting.
Would ITV seriously schedule JESC rather than The X Factor this weekend??
(It's interesting to note that, like Britain, it is often the "second string EBU" broadcasters who are involved - ITV in the UK (when they were), TV4 not SVT in Sweden etc. I think SVT, NRK and DR pulled out to run a Nordic show - RUV and YLE may also be involved as they weren't happy with the pressure of the big show?)
Last edited by noggin on 21 November 2009 8:41pm
NJ
I watched it on ITV1 in 2003 and ITV2 in 2004 and 2005.
*snip completely irrelevant and, to be honest, boring anecdote that has sod all to do with the conversation*
today my AOL Broadband connection has been extremely slow, pushing my patience and tolerance to the limit..
Hardly surprising since you're on AOL so you're lucky you're online at all.. Sure you're not streaming Boogie Beebies while watching Junior Eurovision?
I endorse what you say there, sticking ANYTHING on ITV2 back in November 2004 or November 2005 was a recipe for disaster, as a lot of people still didn't have any form of digital then. If they'd put the FA Cup Final on ITV2 at the time there wouldn't have been many viewers. They should have kept it on ITV1, which everyone could get.
Only you could take my argument, twist it and still come out looking like you didn't read what I wrote.
What I said in the original post was nothing about keeping the show on ITV1, as stated by another contributor it is effectively commercial suicide. What I said was if it doesn't work on ITV1 (which is the biggest commercial broadcaster going), where else can it work. In any case the FA Cup Final is (currently) a Group A protected event so you can't shove it only on ITV2.
Neil Jones
Founding member
I'm sure Tumbler will be watching!
I watched it on ITV1 in 2003 and ITV2 in 2004 and 2005.
*snip completely irrelevant and, to be honest, boring anecdote that has sod all to do with the conversation*
today my AOL Broadband connection has been extremely slow, pushing my patience and tolerance to the limit..
Hardly surprising since you're on AOL so you're lucky you're online at all.. Sure you're not streaming Boogie Beebies while watching Junior Eurovision?
Presumably on the basis it doesn't attract a big enough audience on ITV1 so what chance do smaller channels have.
I endorse what you say there, sticking ANYTHING on ITV2 back in November 2004 or November 2005 was a recipe for disaster, as a lot of people still didn't have any form of digital then. If they'd put the FA Cup Final on ITV2 at the time there wouldn't have been many viewers. They should have kept it on ITV1, which everyone could get.
Only you could take my argument, twist it and still come out looking like you didn't read what I wrote.
What I said in the original post was nothing about keeping the show on ITV1, as stated by another contributor it is effectively commercial suicide. What I said was if it doesn't work on ITV1 (which is the biggest commercial broadcaster going), where else can it work. In any case the FA Cup Final is (currently) a Group A protected event so you can't shove it only on ITV2.
GO
(It's interesting to note that, like Britain, it is often the "second string EBU" broadcasters who are involved - ITV in the UK (when they were), TV4 not SVT in Sweden etc. I think SVT, NRK and DR pulled out to run a Nordic show - RUV and YLE may also be involved as they weren't happy with the pressure of the big show?)
^ Another "second string" broadcaster is Russia's RTR while the Netherlands broadcaster is different to one that does Eurovision. Also Belgium only has the Flemish station doing it while it switches between Flemish and Wallonia each year for Eurovision.
The Scandinavian broadcasters (Finland and Iceland were never involved) pulled out to re-start their MGP programme which was what the JESC was based upon. TV4 took over in Sweden for two years, pulled out last year and then came back this year to try and flog Mimmi Sanden who won Sweden's Got Talent a few years back. Unfortunately for them they realised that the song was too good for the contest and that they would get nowhere performing first on the night so they decided to show it tomorrow morning at 6:45 instead of live tonight! They came 7th tonight incidently.
All the broadcasters that signed up for the first contest were locked into a three year contract which is why ITV entered the 2004 and 2005 shows, sticking them on ITV2 instead. They were repeated the next day during the afternoon on ITV1. It's interesting that ITV never got its hand slapped for this as it was a fundimental rule at the time that it had to be shown live on a channel that could be received by the majority of the viewing public. Croatia did the same in 2006 and had to withdraw or face a sizable fine. Needless to say the EBU are now beggers rather than choosers when it comes to this contest and that rule is long gone.
noggin posted:
(It's interesting to note that, like Britain, it is often the "second string EBU" broadcasters who are involved - ITV in the UK (when they were), TV4 not SVT in Sweden etc. I think SVT, NRK and DR pulled out to run a Nordic show - RUV and YLE may also be involved as they weren't happy with the pressure of the big show?)
^ Another "second string" broadcaster is Russia's RTR while the Netherlands broadcaster is different to one that does Eurovision. Also Belgium only has the Flemish station doing it while it switches between Flemish and Wallonia each year for Eurovision.
The Scandinavian broadcasters (Finland and Iceland were never involved) pulled out to re-start their MGP programme which was what the JESC was based upon. TV4 took over in Sweden for two years, pulled out last year and then came back this year to try and flog Mimmi Sanden who won Sweden's Got Talent a few years back. Unfortunately for them they realised that the song was too good for the contest and that they would get nowhere performing first on the night so they decided to show it tomorrow morning at 6:45 instead of live tonight! They came 7th tonight incidently.
All the broadcasters that signed up for the first contest were locked into a three year contract which is why ITV entered the 2004 and 2005 shows, sticking them on ITV2 instead. They were repeated the next day during the afternoon on ITV1. It's interesting that ITV never got its hand slapped for this as it was a fundimental rule at the time that it had to be shown live on a channel that could be received by the majority of the viewing public. Croatia did the same in 2006 and had to withdraw or face a sizable fine. Needless to say the EBU are now beggers rather than choosers when it comes to this contest and that rule is long gone.
NG
(It's interesting to note that, like Britain, it is often the "second string EBU" broadcasters who are involved - ITV in the UK (when they were), TV4 not SVT in Sweden etc. I think SVT, NRK and DR pulled out to run a Nordic show - RUV and YLE may also be involved as they weren't happy with the pressure of the big show?)
^ Another "second string" broadcaster is Russia's RTR while the Netherlands broadcaster is different to one that does Eurovision. Also Belgium only has the Flemish station doing it while it switches between Flemish and Wallonia each year for Eurovision.
The Netherlands is an interesting set-up - as the NOS channels are effectively a federation of multiple broadcasters, but not regionally split. I think AVRO broadcast on NOS some of the time?
The rag bag of JESC countries is interesting - lots of Eurovision stalwarts are absent (France, Germany, Spain, Greece, Turkey, Portugal, Norway, Iceland, Finland, the Baltics)
Looks like it is mainly Sweden (unusually), part of Benelux, a few former Yugoslav nations, some ex-Soviets and some small mediterranean islands. With the exception of Sweden and Benelux, perhaps the JESC is still a lot better than their home grown shows?
The Scandinavian broadcasters (Finland and Iceland were never involved) pulled out to re-start their MGP programme which was what the JESC was based upon. TV4 took over in Sweden for two years, pulled out last year and then came back this year to try and flog Mimmi Sanden who won Sweden's Got Talent a few years back. Unfortunately for them they realised that the song was too good for the contest and that they would get nowhere performing first on the night so they decided to show it tomorrow morning at 6:45 instead of live tonight! They came 7th tonight incidently.
Do TV4 show it live on one of their digital outlets? If not how do they get round the voting issue? How does Sweden vote if nobody can see the contest?
All the broadcasters that signed up for the first contest were locked into a three year contract which is why ITV entered the 2004 and 2005 shows, sticking them on ITV2 instead. They were repeated the next day during the afternoon on ITV1. It's interesting that ITV never got its hand slapped for this as it was a fundimental rule at the time that it had to be shown live on a channel that could be received by the majority of the viewing public.
Same as the main Eurovision Final ISTR (though there is more latitude with the semis - hence BBC Three showing them)
Croatia did the same in 2006 and had to withdraw or face a sizable fine. Needless to say the EBU are now beggers rather than choosers when it comes to this contest and that rule is long gone.
Does seem that they are flogging a horse that has long since kicked the bucket... I guess music, dance and sport are the only real non-language based formats though...
noggin
Founding member
noggin posted:
(It's interesting to note that, like Britain, it is often the "second string EBU" broadcasters who are involved - ITV in the UK (when they were), TV4 not SVT in Sweden etc. I think SVT, NRK and DR pulled out to run a Nordic show - RUV and YLE may also be involved as they weren't happy with the pressure of the big show?)
^ Another "second string" broadcaster is Russia's RTR while the Netherlands broadcaster is different to one that does Eurovision. Also Belgium only has the Flemish station doing it while it switches between Flemish and Wallonia each year for Eurovision.
The Netherlands is an interesting set-up - as the NOS channels are effectively a federation of multiple broadcasters, but not regionally split. I think AVRO broadcast on NOS some of the time?
The rag bag of JESC countries is interesting - lots of Eurovision stalwarts are absent (France, Germany, Spain, Greece, Turkey, Portugal, Norway, Iceland, Finland, the Baltics)
Looks like it is mainly Sweden (unusually), part of Benelux, a few former Yugoslav nations, some ex-Soviets and some small mediterranean islands. With the exception of Sweden and Benelux, perhaps the JESC is still a lot better than their home grown shows?
Quote:
The Scandinavian broadcasters (Finland and Iceland were never involved) pulled out to re-start their MGP programme which was what the JESC was based upon. TV4 took over in Sweden for two years, pulled out last year and then came back this year to try and flog Mimmi Sanden who won Sweden's Got Talent a few years back. Unfortunately for them they realised that the song was too good for the contest and that they would get nowhere performing first on the night so they decided to show it tomorrow morning at 6:45 instead of live tonight! They came 7th tonight incidently.
Do TV4 show it live on one of their digital outlets? If not how do they get round the voting issue? How does Sweden vote if nobody can see the contest?
Quote:
All the broadcasters that signed up for the first contest were locked into a three year contract which is why ITV entered the 2004 and 2005 shows, sticking them on ITV2 instead. They were repeated the next day during the afternoon on ITV1. It's interesting that ITV never got its hand slapped for this as it was a fundimental rule at the time that it had to be shown live on a channel that could be received by the majority of the viewing public.
Same as the main Eurovision Final ISTR (though there is more latitude with the semis - hence BBC Three showing them)
Quote:
Croatia did the same in 2006 and had to withdraw or face a sizable fine. Needless to say the EBU are now beggers rather than choosers when it comes to this contest and that rule is long gone.
Does seem that they are flogging a horse that has long since kicked the bucket... I guess music, dance and sport are the only real non-language based formats though...
GO
^ Another "second string" broadcaster is Russia's RTR while the Netherlands broadcaster is different to one that does Eurovision. Also Belgium only has the Flemish station doing it while it switches between Flemish and Wallonia each year for Eurovision.
Almost. PSB in the Netherlands consists of three channels (I think) and all its content is provided by several production companies (kind of like C4 but the production companies are treated as seperate broadcasters). Junior Eurovision is done by AVRO while news broadcaster NOS did Eurovision (for some reason) but that'll be taken over by TROS (ha!) from next year who did the Eurovision Dance Contest! Phew!
Greece took part up until last year, Latvia did the first three (because of that contract), Lithuania had to withdraw this year because of their financial woes, France took part once in 2004, Spain took part for the first four years and signed up for the fifth but a new boss at TVE said that the show promoted something they didn't want to be a part of, consequently Portugal no longer had an ally meaning that they quit last year (though it rated very well in the country).
The show's very popular in the Benelux and it was in Scandinavia as well. I think that's surprising to us because we don't have the same attitudes towards kids as they do on the content. The UK's well known for not being a particularly child-loving country!
Do TV4 show it live on one of their digital outlets? If not how do they get round the voting issue? How does Sweden vote if nobody can see the contest?
It was shown on TV4's website but there was no voting in Sweden, their results were purely jury. Other countries now use 50% jury, 50% televoting.
It's interesting to note that, like Britain, it is often the "second string EBU" broadcasters who are involved - ITV in the UK (when they were), TV4 not SVT in Sweden etc. I think SVT, NRK and DR pulled out to run a Nordic show - RUV and YLE may also be involved as they weren't happy with the pressure of the big show?)
Quote:
^ Another "second string" broadcaster is Russia's RTR while the Netherlands broadcaster is different to one that does Eurovision. Also Belgium only has the Flemish station doing it while it switches between Flemish and Wallonia each year for Eurovision.
Quote:
The Netherlands is an interesting set-up - as the NOS channels are effectively a federation of multiple broadcasters, but not regionally split. I think AVRO broadcast on NOS some of the time?
The rag bag of JESC countries is interesting - lots of Eurovision stalwarts are absent (France, Germany, Spain, Greece, Turkey, Portugal, Norway, Iceland, Finland, the Baltics)
Looks like it is mainly Sweden (unusually), part of Benelux, a few former Yugoslav nations, some ex-Soviets and some small mediterranean islands. With the exception of Sweden and Benelux, perhaps the JESC is still a lot better than their home grown shows?
Do TV4 show it live on one of their digital outlets? If not how do they get round the voting issue? How does Sweden vote if nobody can see the contest?