ITV

C3NE was manifestly unpopular in the North East, and it would have disappeared within a couple of months had it not been for the stubbornness of YTV. I think that while there won't be riots in the streets, very few people would think it an improvement for regional names to go.

People are just not bothered with all this branding crap. All that needs to be done is to create programmes that people want to watch, and advertise them effectively. Having the same logo in Ipswich as Kendal matters not one jot.

It's the old bollox empire-building again. If you want to distinguish yourself from the competition, you need to relate to viewers. Another plastic branding campaign endears you to nobody. Why do you think more people (%-wise) watch UTV than any other region?

(Edited by jason at 11:12 pm on Oct. 9, 2001)

i think itv does need some kind of standardisation - because brand image IS as important, if not more important than the product nowerdays - like it or not. B U T

i think ITVs attempts so far have been atrocious - those spinning hearts - with regional logos stuck on in any way shape or form? even channel 5 could have told you that was a nonstarter! (eg the writing size, font differs)

i think itv has a unique selling point in the fact it is a regional service, something CH4 and CH5 havent - so why dont they exploit it.

i would stop all the itv hearts nonesense, every region produce their own idents to reflect their region BUT have a standardised way of laying out the final part of the ident - the bit where the announcer talks. - bit like carlton have the itv logo neatly placed on screen.

i would have only one URL nationally(www.itv.com) and standardise the way billboards, newspaper adverts etc. are designed

what im saying is a bit like STV's beggining and carltons end of the idents

oh and id bring back the central name, and all regions have local continuity

ITV1 needs some national presence.

For national newspapers to cover ITV1 programmes, it needs to be national. Coverage leads to more awareness, leads to higher ratings, leads (usually) to higher advertising revenue.

Most programmes are national anyway, and regional differences in scheduling national programmes (which inhibited press coverage) have more or less ended.

A national schedule is, by and large, a good thing. Especially if you're following a series and move about the country. Crossroads used to be days out depending on the region you were in. How frustrating, if you like that sort of thing.

Much money was wasted on individual companies producing different trailers for the same programmes in the late eighties and early nineties. Just for their logo to appear on them. That was real empire building.

Surely that money would be better spent on regional programming.

People are attached to their local programme contractor, but they are more attached to programming. I think they'll understand when there are separate local and national idents.

Because I like idents, I'd like to see regional variations. But when it's going in front of a nationally-scheduled programme isn't this just self-indulgence?

Perhaps ITV1 should now give its regions names that actually reflect the regions. That would make more sense. So goodbye Carlton, goodbye Granada, goodbye Meridian (no, it doesn't say south and south east England in spite of the arguments that will ensue).

Yes, there was empire-building in the past. But a bit of pragmatism rather than the 'ITV has to control everything' or 'the local regions are not going to accept anything network centre has to offer' doesn't help anyone -- neither of them.

It would be extremely easy for ITV now to make a truly dual-branded system, with dual branded trailers (achieved by simply putting a local DOG on the trailers like HTV used to). More pragmatic ITV regions in the past managed to achieve very close affinity with their viewers for minimal cost, and I don't care what anyone says the cheapest and most effective way of doing that is the use of in-vision continuity!! That way the need for expensively-branded idents goes out of the window. It is much easier to brand a station if you aren't having to constantly change idents because people get bored of them (which is what it all boils down to really). You also get a genuine local relationship going with your viewers, and if done right people recognise your station instantly, not because of some sanitised ad campaign (and lets face it modern, committee-sourced branding exercises all look much the same!!!) but because people feel they 'know' you. If all this doesn't matter, why are newsreaders paid so much? Not for their newsreading capabilities in the main, but because the punters like them.

Meanwhile we have a frankly ludicrous situation, to the point of farce, where a company like Granada spends millions on branding campaigns that go stale after a couple of months, whilst getting all worked up about a few hundred thousand spent on staff. Absolutely stupid. They deserve to be losing viewers.

Well we could use the American system (Which does actually have some merit) and have regional branding during non-networked times of day and a network feed in prime time.

Or - just forget it. Have regional idents which follow certain guidelines. No-one except us actually cares about the national picture. How many people on the street could actually tell you who the ITV company for anywhere other than their own region was (Some people might figure out Yorkshire)

Frankly I don't think anyone would care very much if the programmes were worth watching. Look at E4, possibly the worst presentation of any channel, but I watch it as often as I can because I like the programmes.

And also, dual branding is all very well - but Carlton and their 3 layers (e.g ITV, Carlton, Central News) is a big mess.

i agree - whilst executives make all these decisions about what the channel will be called and who will own it etc. the man on the street isnt really that interested, eg. i am yet to meet any one (its not an exaduration) who recognises the name carlton - everyone i know calls it central or itv.

It's the first time I've been watching Daytime ITV1 for ages this morning and I noticed at few things...

At 9.25, Meridian have an ident and 'Good morning from Meridian. It's 10th October...' blah blah, then a promo then into that Biggest Game in Town programme for 5 minutes with good old Steve 'YTV' Le Feve explaining how it all works but there's also a run through of Daytime on ITV1 which is quite good. The announcer talks about Trisha/This Morning/Biggest Game in Town/Crossroads over video (sadly not the 'hearts' style but of The Biggest Game's graphics) and even when The Bill came up, two of the characters turned around and said 'The Bill, coming up after Crossroads!' in the typical cheesy way.

Then at the end, we have a menu and music for a few seconds before Trisha. Works quite nice - almost like a mini startup!

Cheers, Asa

Yes, they've been doing that since 'Watch to Win' started.
More often that not its Crossroads which gets the longest mention though!

On YTV though, as I expect you remember, its promo first then ident, without any 'good morning' as if they've been on since 6am

Isnt the bill edited for daytrime showings?

I know Birds of a Feature is. Was listening last week to the sound suddenly being turned off for a second. Mind you, you don't need to be a lip-reader to guess what she said...


Separate question - Has anyone been getting a dodgy Meridian reception today? Since this morning there's been flickering at the top of the screen. At the moment it has disappeared...and come back again.

I completely accept that ITV1 is inevitably heading towards a single brand.

I neither like nor dislike this prospect - I'm not particualarly bothered one way or the other whether ITV1 keeps regional identities or not. I don't dislike the regional nature of ITV1, but wouldn't miss it if/when it ceases.

I find it odd how all the 'region lovers' (that phrase is not meant to sound derogatory) manage to frequently interpret any and every change that happens to ITV1 (e.g. adding the '1' to the name; dropping the 'hearts' theme) as a 'sign that Carlton may restore the Central and Westcountry names' .

As it seems inevitable that a single non-regional ITV1 identity will arrive within the fairly forseeable future, for Carlton to restore the regionality that it has previously removed would be pointless. I imagine that Carlton's thinking is that if viewers in several regions get used to the idea of having an on-screen name that isn't exclusive to their region, then when the whole network shares a name, half of ITV1's viewers around the UK will already have grown to live with things being that way.

My opinion:
ITV1 should dual-brand, like they do now but:
- with more space for regional design, and
-- with larger space for regional idents and logos
- with regions free to choose whether to design their own background or take the hearts (as Carlton have done)
- with each region having its own name regardless of ownership (bring back Central and Westcountry)
- with the live-action heart-films made for each region (rather than generic national ones) (i.e. Meridian's heart-films all made in South and so on)
- so it would be more regional freedom of expression but ITV1 would still be mentioned.