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Holding Slides

Holding slides are becoming scarse, but not impossible to find. (July 2010)

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TC
TonyCurrie
Can someone clear something up for me?
When Freeview channels are not on air can the cards like:
'FIVEUSA
BACK AT 12PM'
be considered holding slides or not?

It's a slide (even though they aren't optical slides these days the name is still used) , whether it's 'holding' or not depends on what your definition of a 'holding slide' is. It's not a term I've ever come across outside of this site


Difficult to even consider these as presentation items since, in many cases, these graphics are sent as data to your set top box and generated as stills by the box itself. They aren't transmitted in real time, and the actual programme feed is supressed because usually it's been given over to an entirely different television station. I must admit I've never come across the term 'holding slide' as such. But although these graphics are of course not 35mm slides, the technical term for stills is still 'slides' because it's a description everyone recognises.
RV
Roll VT
We still have 2 boxes of old 35mm slides in the pres suite at UTV that we saved from the skip!
SP
Steve in Pudsey
Out of interest, what is the official term that was used for this style of slide
http://hub.tv-ark.org.uk/images/bbcone/images_cont/1985/slides/bbc1_pebblemill_1985.jpg
(from TV-Ark who also call it a holding slide)

I wonder if the term "holding slide" may have been coined to refer to the "Follows Shortly" slide for the next programme during schools programming?
JJ
jjne
My understanding was always that they were simply "slides", but that they were referred to as "holding slides" (at least this is what a TTTV transmission controller stated) when there was a fault in transmission and they required an appropriate image to "hold" the vision. These were, of course, generally (though not necessarily) the same slides shown before the break immediately before a programme to tell viewers that the show was coming next, and on occasion trotted out to inform of what was coming later.

I say not necessarily because of course TSW/Westward never used these slides to trail a programme coming next, and Tyne Tees only used them intermittently in the case of faults (alternating with a "This Is A Fault/Please Do Not Adjust Your Set" electronically-generated message or a simple static slide of the company logo).

I think a lot of the time a "holding slide" was whatever the controller managed to throw up at the time Smile
SP
Steve in Pudsey
That's a point I'd forgotten - Yorkshire used to introduce programmes over these slides in the early 80s rather than using an ident or IVC

http://www2.tv-ark.org.uk/itvyorkshire/continuity.html
IS
Inspector Sands
Difficult to even consider these as presentation items since, in many cases, these graphics are sent as data to your set top box and generated as stills by the box itself. They aren't transmitted in real time, and the actual programme feed is supressed because usually it's been given over to an entirely different television station.

Indeed, this is the case with many terrestrial stations, not on Sky though - when a station goes off air or changes EPG place it's just a blue screen. Some channels have an overnight slide coming out of their playout suites overnight which is not necessarily seen by all viewers - Virgin for example replace off air channels with a video stream carrying a caption (not generated in the box) even when Sky viewers are seeing a 'back at 6am' caption
IS
Inspector Sands
jjne posted:
My understanding was always that they were simply "slides", but that they were referred to as "holding slides" (at least this is what a TTTV transmission controller stated) when there was a fault in transmission and they required an appropriate image to "hold" the vision.

Yes, that makes sense. When they are just on for a few seconds as continuity they aren't 'holding' anything
JJ
jjne
I suppose it's possible that the phrase has become common on the net because maybe it came from a station that did not generally broadcast the slides, but had them produced *only* for the purposes of fault covering.

That would therefore be the modern term. But as I've not spoken to a controller in many years this is just speculation.
MA
Markymark


I can't think of any commercially available kit that would give such functionality ?
As you say, corrupt signal yes, but a 'legal' frozen image, no ?

Freeze & silence detectors are fairly common in tx suites and coding & mux operations - the old DOC used to have alarms going off all the time; generally monitoring off-air reception, in case a coder or its incoming feed had died. I think they used Miranda probes.
(Generally the culprit was a set top box overheating and freezing; sometimes it would be the end credits of a film being a bit quiet, and despite having a long delay set, divisions on BBC Parliament would often set one off.)


Umm, interesting, thanks. I've never had a client request one.

I presume that's why BBC or Sky News will show a looped bit of footage lasting about 10 seconds, rather that a static image when there's an 'audio only' report or interview. It's one thing to try and keep the viewers attention, but quite another to keep the monitoring happy ! Laughing
AB
aberdeenboy
I'm not aware of any directive to news or other programme makers not to use stills or still graphics... although in practice, a subtle animation is usually put in - such as a zoom on a still - just to make it look a bit more visually interesting.
GE
thegeek Founding member
I presume that's why BBC or Sky News will show a looped bit of footage lasting about 10 seconds, rather that a static image when there's an 'audio only' report or interview. It's one thing to try and keep the viewers attention, but quite another to keep the monitoring happy ! Laughing
ditto for two minutes' silences - you'll often get 'ambient silence' played in instead. Sounds fantastic* on heavily compressed commercial radio stations.

* terrible
CO
Colm
We still have 2 boxes of old 35mm slides in the pres suite at UTV that we saved from the skip!


Excellent! I imagine most of those slides are ones created for local ads which the CA voiced live, which UTV were still running as late as the mid 1990s.

From what I remember, UTV used unbranded programme slides produced by other companies (I have some off-air examples which were sourced from Thames) and very rarely produced ones for their own productions (I've yet to come across any examples) until they began producing their own computer generated ones around 1988.

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