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Eurovision Song Contest - Belgrade 2008

(February 2008)

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NG
noggin Founding member
Hatton Cross posted:
First, a good job by our hosts on the coverage - even though it was getting a bit repetitve watching jib, ped, swooping jib, steadycam, ped, jib cut shots all the way through (bar France when Sven played along with the downbeat Gallic nature of the song and went all 'arthouse' with the shot framing!). I liked the see-thru L.E.D wall and the stage back projection screens added a nice bit of depth to what could have been a rather boring stage performance area.


Use of LED in the set was great this year - if a bit big. Agree that the coverage was a bit repetitive - though much better than 2006/2007 which were both far too wide-shot heavy. The LED mesh worked well - as it did last year - and I think the stage layout with the two vertical steadicam hides worked neatly.

The set was incredibly simple - it felt like it was lacking something physical though - just needed something to give it a bit more depth?

I've preferred the Melodifestivalen sets of recent years.

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Second, what was the point of that globe like frame thing hanging from the auditorium roof. If a jib was flying around near it, then fair enough, but it was too far out and too high for the one at the back of the room. Seemed a bit pointless.


Yep - think someone got their sums wrong with that. There was a distinct lack of deep foreground to make best use of the jibs - think Kiev 2005 did that better.

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Third, the voting. We've been here before, but I hope the words of Sir Terrance has some effect in the corridors of Geneva. Maybe if the BBC got together with France Televisions, ARD and TVE and threatened to cut funding by half to the EBU if something isn't done, that would have an effect.


Wouldn't that be a bit childish? We agreed to the rules, as did ARD, FT and TVE - and we have a lot of power to force change internally. It was because of pressure from the West that the split semis were introduced after all... Is it fair to keep trying to change the rules because we keep losing?

Some of us may think that the rules are unfair - and personally I think that change is required - but it has to be an equitable change - it really isn't on to create yet more divisions in the contest.

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I have suggested in the past a no more than 6 votes to a land or sea bordering country (I know at this point Noggin is going to pull this expression Rolling Eyes !) but after last night's shambles, I think that should only be used as a last resort.


Think that would be too complicated for the viewers to understand...

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So, heres a good way of mixing it up a bit. A split of the semis would be a good place to start.
Tuesday night all the western European countries take part. Thursday all the Eastern European countries warble, sing, chant and scream.


That was one suggestion for this year - the issue is how you decide the split. Greece, Cyprus, Turkey are all quite "East" geographically - but are quite long standing Eurovision countries, as was Yugoslavia (now split into many countries)?

I quite like the idea of the UK, France, Germany and Spain having to go into a semi though.

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Voting takes place only for those countries taking part in that particular semi-final (and when the results are announced the 'big 4' have a 12 point start on everyone else). From those two semis, the top 12 from each one go through to the Saturday final.


Not sure that rigging the playing field for the Big Four would be accepted - in some ways distorting the voting that way is worse than guaranteeing a final place - though of course none of us would go through! On the other hand - most of the diaspora migration is East to West, so creates a West to East voting route, which would be reduced in an East/West semi split.

There are always going to be voting oddities though. Why did Bulgaria give Germany 12 points this year? One of their singers is famous in Bulgaria. Why did Malta give Switzerland 12 points a few (two) years ago? One of the six performers was from Malta.

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At the final, the Western European finalist countries (inc. those knocked out of the semi-finals) can only vote for the Eastern European finalists and vice versa. Hey presto - political voting is confined to the semi-finalists, and the level playing field is returned to the final night (as it should be)


Kind of distorts the contest beyond belief though. Even Robert Mugabe would have trouble running elections that mangled.

One thing nobody is asking is? Is the voting political - or is it more the case that former Soviet nations actually like Russian performers more than those from Germany? If Dima Bilan - who won for Russia - has one three MTV awards in Russia - he is presumably quite popular in the region - as I'm sure shows like that are also shown in the former Soviet Belarus, Ukraine, Georgia etc.
RS
Roy Slaven
Brekkie posted:
The phrase bad loser springs to mind.


I don't thinks so - he's never spoken out before ....despite :

2003 Jemini "Cry Baby" 0 points, 26th out of 26
2004 James Fox "Hold On To Our Love" 29 points, 16th out of 24
2005 Javine "Touch My Fire" 18 points, 22nd out of 24
2006 Daz Sampson "Teenage Life" 25 points, 19th out of 24
2007 Scooch "Flying the Flag (For You)" 19 points, 23rd out of 24
2008 Andy Abraham "Even If" 14 points, 25th out of 25

I am not saying we should have won - far from it -but I agree with Wogan in his interview...there's little point in taking part until it's a level playing field.....and while other countries vote politically and while- lets face it - NO one likes us out there - then I think we will be subject to this ritual annual humiliation for a few years yet.

And if you say that the songs above were abit poor...well...there were plenty of other dodgy songs in the contest this year who were given bucket loads of points by their 'neighbours'.

Anyway, this one could go round and round ....the fact remains it's a very different 'Europe' these days to before 2003.....
RS
Roy Slaven
Btw Noggin........great points ....very well put .
NG
noggin Founding member
What I love is that everyone always starts looking at the UK performances from 2003... Quite conveniently forgetting that we came 3rd in 2002 with Jessica Garlick.

What was the difference? 2002 was a really simple song sung very well - no gimmicks, no cheese, just a great vocal.

Oh well - the other difference was that Russia took part, but none of the other former Soviets (Belarus, Ukraine, Georgia, Azerbaijan etc.) and neither did the other recent Eastern-bloc joiners.

On the other hand there was a stong Baltic (which now forms part of the Viking axis with Scandinavia) and Balkan bloc representation - though I suspect Western Europe and the "Old Eurovision" (Israel, Turkey, Greece, Cyprus etc.) Eastern countries still had the upper hand.

Lisa Andreas, who lived in Ashford, Kent but represented Cyprus a year or two later, did pretty well with a similar concept.

It may not be enough to win - but I think it is probably our best hope. Ignore the cheese, ignore the camp (we see the contest as high camp, the rest of Europe - apart from some bits of Scandinavia and probably Malta - don't), chose someone who can sing, and a song that you might want to listen to on Radio Two - and you might do well.

But then you might not!

Out of interest - would we be asking all these questions if we'd won? Isn't it a bit like the Tories asking for a new electoral system because they lost by a landslide in the last three general elections?
TT
Tumble Tower
Review of 2008 Eurovision Song Contest Grand Final - Saturday 24 May 2008

Host country: Serbia. Venue: Belgrade Arena

The Opening
The Eurovision logo appeared, with a shortened form of Te Deum over it. When I was a kid, they used to go through a full version of Te Deum twice over. It just isn't the same with a cut-down Te Deum.

This was followed by the merging red and blue paint, along with an instrumental of last year's winner "Molitva". UK BBC1 viewers also got Terry Wogan's voice-over.

In past years they've had a longish opening sequence, sometimes they've showed scenes of the host country, with the individual countries' commentator (Terry Wogan in the case of UK BBC1 viewers). For example, in 1984, they showed scenes of Luxembourg, including the RTL balloon. In 1999, they had the film "From Birmingham to Jerusalem" whereby they showed images of different sights around Europe from Birmingham to Jerusalem. None of that sort of thing this year, presumably that was to save valuable time. Instead they got straight to the stage at the Belgrade Arena.

Marija Serifovic appeared to perform a remix of her winning entry from last year. Why did she do a remix? It would have been better for her to have sung it, in full, exactly as she performed it in the main competition (not reprise) last year. After that she performed a second song, featuring the words "Just tell me why, pain is always waiting", but I'm not sure of its official title. During this second song, dancers performed a routine around her. Finally she announced the appearance of hosts Zeljko Joksimovic and Jovana Jankovic. Zeljko and Jovana talked briefly in a number of languages, before the start of the songs.

The Songs
Eight and a half minutes after the Eurovision logo and Te Deum had marked the start came the postcard sequence for the first song in the line-up: Romania. In other words, they got started with the singing really early this year. I can remember, back in the 1980s, when it tended to be a good 15-20 minutes before the singing started.

N.B. There is some debate as to whether UK, Germany and Poland, all of whom tied on 14 points, finished joint 23rd, or whether they were given separate placings (Germany 23rd, Poland 24th and UK 25th). In addition there were a few other tied positions in the final result, which some sources have separated and some haven't. I have taken the points and placings from the Eurovision site click here, which I believe and trust as the only official source.

Song 1: ROMANIA - Nico and Vlad Mirita "Pe-o Margine de Lume" (20th place, 45 points)
A Rene and Renato duet style ballad. It's always tough being the first in the line-up, but was rather flat and dull. It finished 20th place and 45 points. It could hardly expect much better than that. Perhaps it could and should have come a notch or two higher, but it definitely ought to have finished ahead of Azerbaijan, France and Spain, and perhaps Bosnia & Herzegovina.

Song 2: UNITED KINGDOM - Andy Abraham "Even If" (25th place, 14 points)
The first of the Big Four. A much livelier, catchier song, good performance. Was this intended to be a take on the 2001 winner from Estonia "Come On Everybody" sung by Tanel Padar and Dave Benton? It certainly sounded like it to me. One critical difference, this one came last with a measly 14 points. Some sources have said it finished joint last with Germany and Poland. However the said site that I sourced these results from has separated the three countries into Germany 23rd, Poland 24th and UK 25th, so like it or not we finished outright last, 25th out of 25 finalists. This was claimed to be the UK's best attempt for several years. Whatever went so horribly wrong? Once again, bloc voting has been blamed for it. No doubt that's played a part, but the song itself also needs to be taken into consideration. Personally I didn't think much of it when it was picked back in March, in fact none of the six UK hopefuls impressed me much. Quite frankly, "Even If" was the best of a bad bunch, again! It certainly didn't deserve to come last though, I was hoping for 10th to 15th. It should at least have done better than Bosnia-Herzegovina, Azerbaijan, France and Spain.

Song 3: ALBANIA - Olta Boka "Zemren e Lame Peng" (17th place, 55 points)
One of the songs I wanted to qualify from the second semi final. Was this a power ballad? It had a lively, catchy chorus, which made up for the verses being gentle. I think Olta's voice was a bit weak during the verses, which perhaps was a let-down. It finished 17th place with 55 points. It deserved a little better, top 15 I say. Certainly it should have beat the way inferior entry from Spain.

Song 4: GERMANY - No Angels "Disappear" (23rd place, 14 points)
The second Big Four contender. The verses were a bit flat, but the song had a good catchy chorus. I liked the flowing arm movements which went well with the chorus. The middle eight was also significantly noticeable. Good outfits too. I think the ladies' voices could needed to be stronger in the verses. Overall not one to be rated particularly highly, but it ought to have come roughly 15th to 20th. It was definitely better than Spain and France.

Song 5: ARMENIA - Sirusho "Qele Qele" (4th place, 199 points)
The best foreign entry so far, really catchy with easy to remember words "Qele Qele". Loved the arm movements of the lead singer and on-floor dancing by the backing group. That must have taken a great deal of practice. I tried to join in and copy them, but didn't have enough floor space for the floor dancing in my bedroom, which is where I was watching up until the end of Russia's entry. I was hoping this would finish top five, and possibly even win. I'm glad it finished 4th with 199 points.

Song 6: BOSNIA-HERZEGOVINA - Elvir Lakovic Laka "Pokusaj" (10th place, 110 points)
Well this is one that I'd rather not have qualified. After excellent entries from Bosnia & Herzegovina in 2006 & 2007, this was way below par. Who put this through? What was the significance of the washing line, or the ladies knitting? It finished 10th with 110 points. Way more than it deserved! Thank God it didn't win. This should have finished near bottom.

Song 7: ISRAEL - Bo'az Ma'uda "Ke'ilo Kan" (9th place, 124 points)
Another entry I wanted to qualify from semi-final one. Quite a reasonable ballad, I'm glad it finished in the top ten with 9th place and 124 points. About right for points and placing, in my opinion.

Song 8: FINLAND - Terasbetoni "Missa Miehet Ratsastaa" (22nd place, 35 points)
Similar to the winner of two years ago by Lordi, but this time in Finnish. In stark contrast to Lordi's entry two years ago, Terasbetoni fared badly, with just 35 points and 22nd place. In other words bottom four. Interesting. Would it have fared better sung in English? Or is it down to the fact that what worked for you two years ago won't necessarily work again? I'm glad it finished where it did, as I didn't particularly like it, I didn't want it to qualify. There's just one good thing I can praise it for, at least it was sung well. I could make out the lyrics as I followed them on screen.

Song 9: CROATIA - Kraljevi Ulice and 75 Cents "Romanca" (21st place, 44 points)
From thrash metal to a Frank Sinatra era ballad. Liked the lady dancing around the stage. A below par song, but at least it was sung clearly. Could have done a little better, I think. It definitely ought to have finished ahead of France and Spain.

Song 10: POLAND - Isis Gee "For Life" (24th place, 14 points)
A ballad by a female soloist, which I wanted to qualify from semi-final one. Up against the rest of the finalists, I wasn't that impressed by it Saturday night. Still, I think it deserved better than France and Spain.

Song 11: ICELAND - Euroband "This Is My Life" (14th place, 64 points)
A lively ABBAesque song, glad it qualified. One of the best entries so far tonight, well sung and really catchy. After 22 years in the ESC, (Iceland first entered in 1986), I thought this would be their first ever winning entry. I at least expected it in the top ten, if not top five. Unfortunately the best it could muster was 14th place and 64 points. I think they were short measured there. It definitely deserved a lot better.

Song 12: TURKEY - Mor ve Otesi "Deli" (7th place, 138 points)
Some rather nauseating trash really. I didn't want this to qualify, but unfortunately it did, worse luck! How the devil did it achieve 7th place and 138 points? As far as I was concerned, it should have finished towards the bottom. Whatever's wrong with the voting?

Song 13: PORTUGAL - Vania Fernandes "Senhora do Mar" (13th place, 69 points)
First off, I loved the postcard sequence before this song, the routine with the red and green Swiss balls (fit balls) to form the Portuguese flag. Another middle of the road ballad, nothing to get excited about. 13th place and 69 points was just about what it deserved.

Song 14: LATVIA - Pirates of the Sea "Wolves of the Sea" (12th place, 83 points)
Catchy, immediately memorable lyrics, easy to sing. The essential ingredients for a good Eurovision song. Great fun to join in and copy the dance routine. I thoroughly enjoyed having a go at the dance routine Saturday evening. The adult kids' version of the Boogie Beebies dances "Pirate Gang" and "Viking Warrior". Thanks a million to the Latvian peeps for putting "Wolves of the Sea" in. I was disappointed to see it finish 12th with 83 points. This should have at least been top ten, and ideally top five.

Song 15: SWEDEN - Charlotte Perrelli "Hero" (18th place, 47 points)
One of the best songs of the evening, an ABBAesque song with easy to sing lyrics. Great use of lasers towards the end. Charlotte Perrelli (then Nilsson) won for Sweden with "Take Me To Your Heaven" in Jerusalem back in 1999. I was expecting her to do it again for Sweden this year in Belgrade, and win the 2008 Eurovision Song Contest, in fact I voted for her. I was gutted at how poorly she did this time, 18th place with 47 points. She deserved way better than that, top five at least, if not winner.

Song 16: DENMARK - Simon Mathew "All Night Long" (15th place, 60 points)
Now this is one I didn't particularly want to qualify, as I didn't think it was as good as "Drama Queen" last year. Having qualified, it turned out not bad really. Quite a good song, well sung and I liked the dance routine. The beat of this song sounded decidedly similar to that of "Have I The Right?" by The Honeycombs. It finished 15th with 60 points. Again, it deserved a bit better than that, top ten perhaps.

Song 17: GEORGIA - Diana Gurtskaya "Peace Will Come" (11th place, 83 points)
A ballad about peace. A catchy chorus with an instantly memorable title. When I first listened to this on the Eurovision web site a few weeks ago, I was singing the title "Peace will come" without the words in front of me. Good middle eight too. One that I'd class as a protest song. As I've said before, protest or political songs seldom do well. Nicole won for Germany at Harrogate in 1982 with "A Little Peace", and Italy won in 1990 with "Insieme: 1992". I expected "Peace Will Come" to be one of the rare "good protest songs", which like Nicole's song, would do well, if not win. "Peace Will Come" just missed the top ten, with 11th place and 83 points. It should have been well up in the top ten, if not top five.

Song 18: UKRAINE - Ani Lorak "Shady Lady" (2nd place, 230 points)
Another one that I wanted to qualify, as I thought it was a good catchy song, and well sung. Also it had a great dance routine. Not sure it was as good as Verka Serduchka's "Dancing Lasha Tumbai" of last year. I guessed it would finish top ten, if not top five, but was surprised to see it get quite as high as 2nd place and 230 points.

Song 19: FRANCE - Sebastien Tellier "Divine" (19th place, 47 points)
The third Big Four contender, the song from France. Controversially, their offering this year was predominantly English with a bit of French towards the end. Was that their attempt at doing better than their appalling scores of recent years? Personally this wasn't much better than their efforts of the last few years. Basically it sounded to me like an imitation of the 1960s hit "Hippy Hippy Shake". If so, it was a rather weak and poor imitation. It finished 19th place with 47 points. More than it deserved, it should have been in the bottom four, I think.

Song 20: AZERBAIJAN - Elnur Huseynov and Samir Javadzadeh "Day After Day" (8th place, 132 points)
One of this year's two newbies. Just like San Marino, this didn't deserve to qualify. It was a heap of nauseating trash. I was disgusted to see it high as on the scoreboard during the voting last night, and to finish 8th place with 132 points. Another song that should have finished near the bottom.

Song 21: GREECE - Kalomoira "Secret Combination" (3rd place, 218 points)
A catchy, memorable song, with a good dance routine. I wanted this to qualify, and am glad it did. One of the better songs of the night. I was expecting this to appear in the top ten, if not top five, but didn't expect it to win.

Song 22: SPAIN - Rodolfo Chikilicuatre "Baila el Chiki-Chiki" (16th place, 55 points)
The last of the Big Four to perform. What a heap of utter garbage! How on Earth did it finish 16th with 55 points? It deserved to finish last with nul points. I was shocked when Portugal gave them 10 and Andorra gave them 12. Whatever next, top marks to what I thought was the worst song in the grand final? Neighbourly voting, me thinks.

Song 23: SERBIA - Jelena Tomasevic "Oro" (6th place, 160 points)
Last year's winner, this year's hosts, and the final direct qualifier to perform. One of the best songs of the night, a beautiful ballad with a catchy chorus "Nuna nej", and well sung at that. In fact I think it was better than "Molitva" from last year. Terry Wogan said "Maybe Serbia could make it two years on the trot". I wasn't so sure about that, but this song definitely deserved top ten, if not top five.

Song 24: RUSSIA - Dima Bilan "Believe" (1st place, 272 points)
Dima Bilan first represented Russia two years ago with "Never Let You Go", and it finished 2nd with 248 points. It had the gimmick of a lady rising from a grand piano. Dima Bilan was back this year, and won with 272 points. Once again, a gimmick was thrown in, the ice skater on the tiny rink. Was that real ice or plastic? Evidently it must have been something that could be wheeled on quickly, and anchored in position. At the start Dima was singing whilst sitting on the floor and leaning forwards, before turning around and lying on his back. He finally stood up at the start of the second verse. The skater began skating at the start of the second chorus, any reason why he didn't start skating earlier? As for the song itself, a good ballad with a catchy chorus. The phrase "Believe in" was unforgettable from the outset. In addition the middle eight was reasonably catchy. For once the penultimate song in the line-up actually won. Ironically I wasn't expecting this to qualify, but didn't mind it doing so. Saturday night, I guessed it would be a high flyer, perhaps top five, but not win. As already said, I was originally expecting Sweden to win, and voted for them, but when I realised early on in the voting that Sweden had no hope, I was routing for Russia. I was so glad they overtook Greece, and eventually won.

Song 25: NORWAY - Maria Haukaas Storeng "Hold On, Be Strong" (5th place, 182 points)
The final song in the line-up was one of the best. Another beautiful ballad with a memorable, catchy chorus, and flowing arm movements. Again, I saw this as one of the best of the night, up there with Sweden, but come finish with, I voted for Sweden. This definitely deserved a top five placing. I'm glad it finished in the top five, on 5th place and 182 points. Who said there were no high-ranking Western European countries?

Tele-voting and Recap
The last few years we've had someone hit a gong, turn an hourglass over or ring a handbell to mark the start of the voting. This time they had Serbian basketball legend Vlade Divac to mark the start of voting by throwing a basketball into the audience. It took about 6½ minutes to recap the songs. I loved the way the aston said "DO NOT VOTE FOR THE UK Your vote won't count and you may be charged" when our song was being shown in brief. Well I suppose someone tried forming the non-existent UK number by putting 02 on the back end of the "stem". By the time there was 5 minutes and 45 seconds of voting time left, there was a second recap of the songs. There used to be only one recap. By the time the second recap finished, there was just 1 minute and 35 seconds of voting time left. Finally there was a ten second countdown to the end, at which point the message "Stop Voting" appeared. The BBC put up the message "LINES ARE CLOSED - DO NOT CALL! Your vote won't count and you may be charged". Well I suppose that was to cover themselves against people complaining about being charged for making a call that didn't count. By the way, does anyone know why UK viewers weren't able to text vote this year? Jovana said at the start that you can vote by phone or SMS (text). This time I wanted to vote for Sweden, but had to do a phone call from my Vodafone mobile. The last couple years I've voted by text on Eurovision night.

Interval Act
A weddings and funerals band. Terry Wogan said "This is not in the same class as Riverdance". The dancers in red and blue outfits who appeared in one of the semis were back for some more dancing with the band. On the whole, this interval act was, quite frankly, rather disappointing. It didn't impress me much, anyway. In my opinion, it was a rather poor time filler compared to Riverdance back in 1994. How many of even the keenest Eurovision fans used this time to go to the toilet and/or make a cup of tea or coffee instead of enduring this poor effort? Total duration of interval act: about 9 minutes.

Voting Time
Time now for the 43 countries (finalists and non-finalists) to announce their votes, starting with the UK and finishing with Denmark. In each case, the 1 to 7 appeared as a "ladder" bottom-up (1 at the bottom, 7 at the top). You barely had chance to read them before they disappeared, and the scoreboard appeared. The spokesperson then announced the 8, 10 and 12 point scores and the scoreboard shuffled accordingly. On the 12 point score, they zoomed in on the calling country's name, then in on the name of the country getting 12 points. First time I've seen that happen. Finally a message would appear e.g. GREECE gets 12 points from United Kingdom. Another first was the progress bar on the bottom, e.g. 10 of 43 COUNTRIES VOTING. One other good thing, at least the text was a decent size this year, after last year's scoreboard had lettering which was said to be too small.

Here was the voting order: UK, FYR Macedonia, Ukraine, Germany, Estonia, Bosnia & Herzegovina, Albania, Belgium, San Marino, Latvia, Bulgaria, Serbia, Israel, Cyprus, Moldova, Iceland, France, Romania, Portugal, Norway, Hungary, Andorra, Poland, Slovenia, Armenia, Czech Republic, Romania, Netherlands, Turkey, Malta, Ireland, Switzerland, Azerbaijan, Greece, Finland, Croatia, Sweden, Belarus, Lithuania, Russia, Montenegro, Georgia, Denmark. I guess that order was determined by a draw, does anyone know?

Some notable moments:

Zeljko said "Bonsoir Londres" instead of "Good evening London" when the UK were called up, so the English wouldn't make remarks about his funny British accent. After I'd voted for Sweden, UK gave nothing to Sweden.

San Marino gave UK 6 points and Ireland gave UK 8 points. Nothing from Malta.

Cyprus gave 12 to Greece. However Greece couldn't give 12 back to Cyprus, so they gave 12 to Armenia.

I was disappointed to see Latvia still on only 17 points after 15 countries had voted. They picked up later, and finished on 83 points.

Iceland gave 12 to Denmark, whoa there's a surprise!

Initially Greece looked as though they'd win. By the time 15 countries had voted, Russia were in a tie with them. Greece pulled ahead again briefly, but by the time Portugal cast their votes (19th to do so), Russia overtook Greece, and held the lead thereafter.

Russia put Ukraine ahead of Greece.

Bosnia & Serbia gave 12 to Serbia, and Serbia gave 12 points to Bosnia & Herzegovina. Is this likely to become another Cyprus-Greece style relationship?

Croatia gave 10 points to Serbia, and 12 points to Bosnia & Herzegovina. The top two scores exchanged between ex-Yugoslav nations again.

Until Bulgaria voted, Germany had no points. Bizarrely, Bulgaria gave Germany 12. That was odd, considering they finished on 14 points. What made Bulgaria think Germany was best of the night to deserve 12 points?

From time to time they showed snippets of the current top 3. I think that's anther first timer.

Montenegro awarded some interesting marks to the three ex-Yugoslav finalists. They gave 10 to Bosnia & Herzegovina, and 12 to Serbia. Top marks to their partner in the Serbia & Montenegro era. However they only gave 2 to Croatia. Why only 2 to Croatia?

After Montenegro had cast their votes, Terry Wogan said "Russia have won it as far as I'm concerned, I can't see them being caught". By then Russia were on 264 followed by Ukraine 213, so with two countries left to vote (Georgia and Denmark), the worst that could have happened would have been Russia 264, Ukraine 237. So by this time, Russia were safe, and had already won.

When the spokeswoman for Georgia appeared, and was about to announce giving 12 to Armenia, she sung a snippet of Armenia's chorus. Terry Wogan reacted "No need to audition, me dear". Any reason why Georgia gave 12 to Armenia?

The final country to vote, Denmark, gave 12 points to Iceland, and nothing to Russia. Mind you, Russia were safe at least 3 countries before the end.

Voting duration: approximately 47 minutes.

After Voting
Russia won with 272 points. Having first entered in 1994, it had taken them 14 years to get their first win. That now means TWO of the seven who debuted in 1994 have now had their first win (Estonia 2001, Russia 2008).

Some fireworks were let off, and then there was a delay whilst the winners took the long walk to the stage. The trophy was presented to them. Marija Serifovic, who won last year, presented the trophy, which resembled a microphone.

UK viewers heard Terry Wogan's comments about the voting, e.g. "You have to say that this is no longer a music contest", "Indeed, Western European participants have to decide whether they want to take part from here on, because their prospects are poor".

Reprise
Dima Bilan performed his winning entry again. This time I joined in and copied Dima's arm movements, and the skater's twirls. Any reason why the skating didn't start until the second chorus? The credits rolled over the song towards the end. Was it really necessary for Terry Wogan to talk over it towards the end? Couldn't they have a separate closing tune with credits and individual countries' voiceover after the winner's reprise?

Finally they showed the Eurovision logo. No Te Deum. In the eighties, they tended to play Te Deum in full at the end.

And Finally
Well altogether, it was another superb contest. Well done to presenters Zeljko and Jovana, all countries' entrants, those involved in the interval act, the spokespeople who announced the results and everyone else involved in the Contest.

Commiserations to the UK for doing so badly, but at the end of the day, it's not about the winning, it's the taking part that counts. We've got to accept being placed near the bottom of the results table as well as near the top. It would be downright negative for us to withdraw indefinitely from the Contest. Face it, in the 1960s to 1990s, Finland had plenty of placings in the bottom half in the final result, including a few bottom placings. Finland even had three "nul points" (1962, 1965, 1982). The UK has done badly the last six years (2003 to 2008), but statistically (under the law of averages) I suppose it's time for us to go through that phase after five wins and loads of second placings. Who knows what result could be possible next year?
ST
Stuart
Somebody has been busy since Saturday night! Shocked
BR
Brekkie
Knife crime, rising food prices, fuel poverty... nope, for some MPs Eurovision is top of their priorities...
http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/broadcasting/a96738/bbc-defends-eurovision-funding.html

And if the BBC are only putting £173,000 into the pot, it's an absolute bargain for a three-hour ratings winning event.
JO
Joe
StuartPlymouth posted:
Somebody has been busy since Saturday night! Shocked

Did you read it? I can't be bothered.
NG
noggin Founding member
BTW - www.esctoday.com has some very interesting stats breakdowns (well interesting for some of us!)

Portugal coming second in their semi was a surprise for me. (Also Sweden were VERY lucky that they got the jury wildcard - they came 12th in the televoting of the second semi - nearly a Sweden-less final which would have been close to a national disaster for them!)

The interesting thing is that if you changed the system to allow only finalists to vote, and disallowed voting from the semifinalists who were knocked out, the winner and runner up would have remained the same, but Norway would have done better, and Sweden worse.

The UK would still have come last - along with Germany - with 0 points...

See here : http://www.esctoday.com/news/read/12001

Also they do an East / West split - seeing who would have won if only East countries or only West countries voted.

Greece would have won if only Western countries voted, followed by Armenia, Norway, Ukraine and Russia.

Russia would (unsurprisingly) have won if only Eastern countries had voted, followed by Ukraine, Greece, Azerbaijan and Serbia.

This analysis here : http://www.esctoday.com/news/read/12003

This kind of confirms that Greece and Ukraine had more pan-European appeal than Russia - which kind of fits with a very subjectiver personal view of the songs.

Personally I thought Greece was a pale imitation of Helena Papirizou who won in Kiev in 2005 - and she didn't have anywhere near as good a voice. Ukraine had a good track, and her vocals were much better in the final than the semi. She sold it very well on stage as well.

The one bit of good news in all this - I think - is that Norway did so well, with such a simple song, well sung, with no gimmicks. Sure it did well from being a popular Nordic country - but I was still happy it did so well. I was also pleased for Portugal - another song that did well based on the song and vocal performance, and didn't depend on pyros, bits of OTT staging etc.
MA
Markymark
Brekkie posted:
Knife crime, rising food prices, fuel poverty... nope, for some MPs Eurovision is top of their priorities...
http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/broadcasting/a96738/bbc-defends-eurovision-funding.html

And if the BBC are only putting £173,000 into the pot, it's an absolute bargain for a three-hour ratings winning event.


Good grief, is that all they pay !!!! The Beeb spend more than that on some trailers.

As you say, a very cheap way to fill three hours worth of time on peak time BBC 1. I can't see the Beeb ever dropping the show, if that figure is true, as long as the UK doesn't win of course, ahh.... now cynics might say...... Wink
BR
Brekkie
Markymark posted:
Brekkie posted:
Knife crime, rising food prices, fuel poverty... nope, for some MPs Eurovision is top of their priorities...
http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/broadcasting/a96738/bbc-defends-eurovision-funding.html

And if the BBC are only putting £173,000 into the pot, it's an absolute bargain for a three-hour ratings winning event.


Good grief, is that all they pay !!!! The Beeb spend more than that on some trailers.

As you say, a very cheap way to fill three hours worth of time on peak time BBC 1. I can't see the Beeb ever dropping the show, if that figure is true, as long as the UK doesn't win of course, ahh.... now cynics might say...... Wink


It seems very low doesn't it, if it is true. I was thinking they were putting well over a million into it.


noggin posted:
(Also Sweden were VERY lucky that they got the jury wildcard - they came 12th in the televoting of the second semi - nearly a Sweden-less final which would have been close to a national disaster for them!)

The interesting thing is that if you changed the system to allow only finalists to vote, and disallowed voting from the semifinalists who were knocked out, the winner and runner up would have remained the same, but Norway would have done better, and Sweden worse.

The UK would still have come last - along with Germany - with 0 points...

See here : http://www.esctoday.com/news/read/12001

Also they do an East / West split - seeing who would have won if only East countries or only West countries voted.

Greece would have won if only Western countries voted, followed by Armenia, Norway, Ukraine and Russia.

Russia would (unsurprisingly) have won if only Eastern countries had voted, followed by Ukraine, Greece, Azerbaijan and Serbia.


I really think alot of this is open to interpretation depending on what stand point you take to begin with.

Firstly, UK - 0 points. That sounds about right - it really was an awful song, but we know from him coming 2nd in the X Factor there are alot of people who were conned into believing this guy was talented.

Sweden scoring so low surprised me considering they were amongst the faves, but having seen the song and performance it shouldn't surprise me really. Considering though Sweden seem to put the most effort into Eurovision I do think they should be added to the "big four".

The East/West split is interesting, but not as different as some like to make out - the main players are in both top fives.


Back to the "big four" debate - one issue never touched upon is possible resentment that the "big four" do automatically get a guaranteed place in the final. It is blatant favouritism - viewers elsewhere may not think they've earned their place in the final, and also it means that the performances aren't heard in the semi-finals either, which could be an additional hindrance.

The Mirror today have outlined all UK outcomes over the 50+ years, and of course try to blame recent woes on Eastern Europe - but really none of the songs in the last 10 years or so particularly deserve to be in the top 15-20. Most were quite forgettable.


The BBC and those behind the UK involvement have just got to stop looking to blame factors outside their control and sort out the problems they can control - the selection process. And then they have to play the game themselves.
NG
noggin Founding member
Markymark posted:
Brekkie posted:
Knife crime, rising food prices, fuel poverty... nope, for some MPs Eurovision is top of their priorities...
http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/broadcasting/a96738/bbc-defends-eurovision-funding.html

And if the BBC are only putting £173,000 into the pot, it's an absolute bargain for a three-hour ratings winning event.


Good grief, is that all they pay !!!! The Beeb spend more than that on some trailers.

As you say, a very cheap way to fill three hours worth of time on peak time BBC 1. I can't see the Beeb ever dropping the show, if that figure is true, as long as the UK doesn't win of course, ahh.... now cynics might say...... Wink


Yep - the Beeb would be mad to drop Eurovision if that is the price tag for showing the event.

However I suspect that doesn't include the costs of covering it (the pre-selection show, sending commentary teams, galleries at TV Centre to co-ordinate graphics and mix in the commentary etc.) nor the costs of sending national delegations including dancers, backing singers, choreographer, event producers etc.

Still for 3 and a quarter hours of entertainment delivering the ratings it does it is very safe in the UK I'd have thought. It doesn't rate as well in other countries though...

Interesting that even countries that have pulled out - like Austria - still send a commentator and show the final...

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