BR
C4 is in a serious lull at the moment on all fronts really, but especially the more commercial side of the station. It's lacking in both original and imported drama and comedy is thin on the ground - while scheduling isn't helping. The second series of Friday Night Dinner is pencilled in for Sundays for example and most comedy has to stand on it's own now, rather than be part of a decent Friday night block which served C4 so well for so long. Factual entertainment formats which have served C4 so well over the last decade are very thin on the ground too.
The PSB side is also faltering - most documentaries are now of the cheap docu-soap variety and there just isn't the mix of science, history and more populist factual content that there was just a few years ago.
The PSB side is also faltering - most documentaries are now of the cheap docu-soap variety and there just isn't the mix of science, history and more populist factual content that there was just a few years ago.
SG
Why stuff the mornings with everybody loves raymond and frasier id even perfer a repeat of desmonds the barber shop comedy but serious something new please .. even the 5 day hollyoaks is enough remember when you had weekday choice at half six with only a couple days hollyoaks.Surely the simpsons don't need to be on every day at 6 the schedules is getting dull and the same 6-7pm shows for years.
MU
Channel 4's franchise collapsed when they lost Big Brother and Friends. Its so bad now, it makes Channel Five look 'cool'.
If they ditch Everybody Loves Raymond, The Simpsons and Hollyoaks then basically the channel would be no use. As said before, the channel is built on american imported programmes and Hollyoaks.
Why stuff the mornings with everybody loves raymond and frasier id even perfer a repeat of desmonds the barber shop comedy but serious something new please .. even the 5 day hollyoaks is enough remember when you had weekday choice at half six with only a couple days hollyoaks.Surely the simpsons don't need to be on every day at 6 the schedules is getting dull and the same 6-7pm shows for years.
Channel 4's franchise collapsed when they lost Big Brother and Friends. Its so bad now, it makes Channel Five look 'cool'.
If they ditch Everybody Loves Raymond, The Simpsons and Hollyoaks then basically the channel would be no use. As said before, the channel is built on american imported programmes and Hollyoaks.
:-(
A former member
Why stuff the mornings with everybody loves raymond and frasier id even perfer a repeat of desmonds the barber shop comedy but serious something new please .. even the 5 day hollyoaks is enough remember when you had weekday choice at half six with only a couple days hollyoaks.Surely the simpsons don't need to be on every day at 6 the schedules is getting dull and the same 6-7pm shows for years.
Channel 4's franchise collapsed when they lost Big Brother and Friends. Its so bad now, it makes Channel Five look 'cool'.
If they ditch Everybody Loves Raymond, The Simpsons and Hollyoaks then basically the channel would be no use. As said before, the channel is built on american imported programmes and Hollyoaks.
CH4 collapsed WHEN there got BB in the first place, up till 2000 it was a good mix of shows then it become crap and been going down hill ever since. Five not cool because of BB, there only million people watching it on five.
SW
I'd say the truth is somewhere between the previous two posts. I'd say Channel 4 started to decline when Endemol charged them an extortinate amount of the final few series' of Big Brother which completely bombed, but Channel 4 had put all of their money into it by making cuts and were left with nothing. They still had some good British dramas that pushed boundaries such as Sugar Rush, Shameless etc (although Shameless went off the boil a few years ago) whilst they often aired innovative or experimental programmes like Space Cadets or Shattered. They were both variations of Big Brother but they've taken those variations to the extreme with some of their 'creative renewal', so those types of shows don't seem to have a place anymore.
I also think some of their issue is overexposure of their shows, and shafting their big programmes when a new one comes along. An extreme example of that is Brookside when BB came along, and now they have neither. Channel 4 lacks any kind of history with its programming in the way that BBC, ITV and even Channel 5 have. Meanwhile they're constantly showing the same shows on what seems like a loop- Million Pound Drop and Come Dine With Me. Both used to be capable of big audiences for Channel 4, but now they're pretty average.
My final issue is that they don't seem to have any confidence in their new programming, for example Baggage on a Friday night. It's absolute trash TV at its best (or worst, whichever way you look at it) and could easily become a big hit for them- just as Take Me Out has for ITV, but they've gone and put it up against Eastenders & Corrie. Those programmes subsequently never take off, and they have to wheel out MPD yet again.
I also think some of their issue is overexposure of their shows, and shafting their big programmes when a new one comes along. An extreme example of that is Brookside when BB came along, and now they have neither. Channel 4 lacks any kind of history with its programming in the way that BBC, ITV and even Channel 5 have. Meanwhile they're constantly showing the same shows on what seems like a loop- Million Pound Drop and Come Dine With Me. Both used to be capable of big audiences for Channel 4, but now they're pretty average.
My final issue is that they don't seem to have any confidence in their new programming, for example Baggage on a Friday night. It's absolute trash TV at its best (or worst, whichever way you look at it) and could easily become a big hit for them- just as Take Me Out has for ITV, but they've gone and put it up against Eastenders & Corrie. Those programmes subsequently never take off, and they have to wheel out MPD yet again.
BR
C4 was very strong when it had Big Brother as it's cash cow with an excellent mix of drama and comedy alongside Big Brother (and mainly funded by it), plus a decent slate of innovative factual entertainment. Alongside this they were doing far stronger PSB stuff than they are at the moment.
The decision to axe Big Brother was the right one but they just fell apart without it - the schedule has lost structure and the content commissioned as part of the so called "creative renewal" simply hasn't been strong enough - cheap programming has got exactly the kind of ratings it deserves.
The decision to axe Big Brother was the right one but they just fell apart without it - the schedule has lost structure and the content commissioned as part of the so called "creative renewal" simply hasn't been strong enough - cheap programming has got exactly the kind of ratings it deserves.
DV
Channel Four, must not reenter the Breakfast market. It's 'full'. The renaissance of radio listening in the morning and MP3 player use simply doesn't warrant the risk. The UK demand seems stuck at the low level of 3M. For C4 to succeed it would need to attract NEW take-up of AM TV, BBC Breakfast and Daybreak seem to me to have solid, if pitiful levels, which I doubt could be squeezed further. C4 would need well north of 1M as a start to warrant the move.
One thing a future Broadcasting Act could do to help the channel is remove it's 'publisher broadcaster' role and allow it to produce it's own content, within limits, say a max of 30 percent, experiments would be much easier to try then.. That status was fine in the 1980's and 1990's to protect the nacent production industry. With the multiplicity of outlets now, I feel that the protection puts C4 at a disadvantage now without adding much to the indies.
Perhaps C4 need to look at Children's Television, something the networks are retreating from, and leaving to niche channels, I think there'd be a reasonable audience for say the 1100-1200 and 1500-1630 blocks for that purpose,
C4 also needs to look at it's family of channels and consider really whether all the flavours suit the 2010's. A full values test would be useful. An analysis of the take up of 4seven content should be first on the list in my view.
One thing a future Broadcasting Act could do to help the channel is remove it's 'publisher broadcaster' role and allow it to produce it's own content, within limits, say a max of 30 percent, experiments would be much easier to try then.. That status was fine in the 1980's and 1990's to protect the nacent production industry. With the multiplicity of outlets now, I feel that the protection puts C4 at a disadvantage now without adding much to the indies.
Perhaps C4 need to look at Children's Television, something the networks are retreating from, and leaving to niche channels, I think there'd be a reasonable audience for say the 1100-1200 and 1500-1630 blocks for that purpose,
C4 also needs to look at it's family of channels and consider really whether all the flavours suit the 2010's. A full values test would be useful. An analysis of the take up of 4seven content should be first on the list in my view.
BR
No reason at all for C4 to enter the kids TV market at the moment - it would be suicide for them to mess with Countdown and Deal or No Deal to provide a service both ITV and the BBC deem not worth it.
I disagree with you on breakfast TV too - there probably isn't a better time than now for a new player in the market with Daybreak struggling and millions of Moyles fans unlikely to warm to Nick Grimshaw. However until C4 sorts out it's primetime issues it's probably not the right time for them - and there are other areas such as late at night where they could make an impact and probably be more commercially successful.
P.S. An interesting interview with C4's new Head of Drama:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2012/sep/23/piers-wenger-channel-4-drama?CMP=twt_fd
I disagree with you on breakfast TV too - there probably isn't a better time than now for a new player in the market with Daybreak struggling and millions of Moyles fans unlikely to warm to Nick Grimshaw. However until C4 sorts out it's primetime issues it's probably not the right time for them - and there are other areas such as late at night where they could make an impact and probably be more commercially successful.
P.S. An interesting interview with C4's new Head of Drama:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2012/sep/23/piers-wenger-channel-4-drama?CMP=twt_fd
GO
How would experiments be easier to try with an in house production team? They're not cheap to run. If anything they'd go for more populist programmes in order to keep the business from failing.
Surely the whole point in outsourcing with any company is that generally it's cheaper and carries less risk.
One thing a future Broadcasting Act could do to help the channel is remove it's 'publisher broadcaster' role and allow it to produce it's own content, within limits, say a max of 30 percent, experiments would be much easier to try then.. That status was fine in the 1980's and 1990's to protect the nacent production industry. With the multiplicity of outlets now, I feel that the protection puts C4 at a disadvantage now without adding much to the indies.
How would experiments be easier to try with an in house production team? They're not cheap to run. If anything they'd go for more populist programmes in order to keep the business from failing.
Surely the whole point in outsourcing with any company is that generally it's cheaper and carries less risk.
DV
Concept I have is for short series, that would legally avoid the expense of commissioning, produced in house and then if successful could be sold on to independent production, who would then exploit the 'intellectual property'. Saves the risk for the inpendent sector of failure, and enables C4 to monetise the production before the rights pass on to the independent sector.
As for excluding Children's programming, remember it was C4's intial remit to be different. Shunting Countfown back to the 1630 slot, and running DOND at 1700 would be useful challengers to the quizzing slot on BBC ONE and ITV.
As for excluding Children's programming, remember it was C4's intial remit to be different. Shunting Countfown back to the 1630 slot, and running DOND at 1700 would be useful challengers to the quizzing slot on BBC ONE and ITV.
:-(
A former member
Concept I have is for short series, that would legally avoid the expense of commissioning, produced in house and then if successful could be sold on to independent production, who would then exploit the 'intellectual property'. Saves the risk for the inpendent sector of failure, and enables C4 to monetise the production before the rights pass on to the independent sector.
As for excluding Children's programming, remember it was C4's intial remit to be different. Shunting Countfown back to the 1630 slot, and running DOND at 1700 would be useful challengers to the quizzing slot on BBC ONE and ITV.
As for excluding Children's programming, remember it was C4's intial remit to be different. Shunting Countfown back to the 1630 slot, and running DOND at 1700 would be useful challengers to the quizzing slot on BBC ONE and ITV.
So to make CH4 different you suggest ch4 put put a gameshow at the same time as everyone else?