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Big Brother

Series Discussion. (February 2007)

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GS
Gavin Scott Founding member
James Martin posted:
Sorry to do another post but I think Mr Scott missed the point of that episode!

Gavin Scott posted:
If you want the best explanation of why then I suggest you watch the episode of South Park that Mr Martin suggested some pages back.


If you've seen that episode all the way through the episode concentrates on how Randy Marsh (Stan's dad) is consistently witch-hunted for saying The N Word live on television.

The parallels with Emily and the British Press are uncanny.

So I don't get your point about how white people don't get discriminated against,.


I'm going to have to come clean and say the last few post from me around here were "post pub", and post pub I get very absolute and, frankly, stroppy.

Racism isn't one way traffic, I accept. There are a myriad instances in our day to day lives that we are negatively dealt, and sometimes race will play a part in that. We all discriminate to everyone, all the time. Its demonstrated in our actions and by what we say.

The difference is the "n" word.

The "n" word stands for what was done to a race of people when they were slaves to white people. Its dehumanising. You can't get away from that. Whatever year it currently is when you are reading this, that's what it means.

As words go its pretty powerful, and as we learn in South Park, "it doesn't matter if you said it by accident, it's still a big deal ".

Beyond any broadcasting scenario, Emily broke a social taboo. The "n" word might have a contemporary understanding within your posse or family, but she was out of her comfort zone. To use the word without a tacit frame of reference was just odd.

The conclusion of the South Park story wasn't Randy's "victimisation", it is Stan coming to realise that as a white person he will never understand why black people are so upset by the word, and why it can make black people mad when a white person says it in any context.

This may be a little off topic, but its certainly relevant to what went on last week, and I'm using up all the posts I've missed during this damp squib of a series.
BA
Banksoriginal
It's about time this show started to flop
NB
NerdBoy
Fair enough, but I can't see how South Park are allowed to use the word but others not, even if it is for humour.
BR
Brekkie
It's all about context again - it's fine for South Park (or Big Brother) to show someone saying the word as long as they show that it's unacceptable for that person to say the word
NB
NerdBoy
Brekkie Boy posted:
It's all about context again - it's fine for South Park (or Big Brother) to show someone saying the word as long as they show that it's unacceptable for that person to say the word


So it's ok to say it in order to point out it's unacceptable to say it?
PA
pad
Banksoriginal posted:
It's about time this show started to flop


So it can join EastEnders? Rolling Eyes

Things will pick up. It's better to start on a whimper and end on a high than otherwise.
GS
Gavin Scott Founding member
NerdBoy posted:
Brekkie Boy posted:
It's all about context again - it's fine for South Park (or Big Brother) to show someone saying the word as long as they show that it's unacceptable for that person to say the word


So it's ok to say it in order to point out it's unacceptable to say it?


South Park is a provocative show, and there is a certain amount of shock factor. Nonetheless it is a valid attempt to explore the power of the word, it's consequences and what it means to those affected by it.
NB
NerdBoy
South Park makes great play on the fact they can use offensive terms and get away with it. Being ignorant to possible offensive is bad but doing it on purpose is worse. I'd like to know the number of people still using 'spastic', 'idiot' or 'gay' as insults who were upset by 'n*****' being uttered.
MH
miss hellfire
Gavin Scott posted:
James Martin posted:
Sorry to do another post but I think Mr Scott missed the point of that episode!

Gavin Scott posted:
If you want the best explanation of why then I suggest you watch the episode of South Park that Mr Martin suggested some pages back.


If you've seen that episode all the way through the episode concentrates on how Randy Marsh (Stan's dad) is consistently witch-hunted for saying The N Word live on television.

The parallels with Emily and the British Press are uncanny.

So I don't get your point about how white people don't get discriminated against,.


I'm going to have to come clean and say the last few post from me around here were "post pub", and post pub I get very absolute and, frankly, stroppy.

Racism isn't one way traffic, I accept. There are a myriad instances in our day to day lives that we are negatively dealt, and sometimes race will play a part in that. We all discriminate to everyone, all the time. Its demonstrated in our actions and by what we say.

The difference is the "n" word.

The "n" word stands for what was done to a race of people when they were slaves to white people. Its dehumanising. You can't get away from that. Whatever year it currently is when you are reading this, that's what it means.

As words go its pretty powerful, and as we learn in South Park, "it doesn't matter if you said it by accident, it's still a big deal ".

Beyond any broadcasting scenario, Emily broke a social taboo. The "n" word might have a contemporary understanding within your posse or family, but she was out of her comfort zone. To use the word without a tacit frame of reference was just odd.

The conclusion of the South Park story wasn't Randy's "victimisation", it is Stan coming to realise that as a white person he will never understand why black people are so upset by the word, and why it can make black people mad when a white person says it in any context.

This may be a little off topic, but its certainly relevant to what went on last week, and I'm using up all the posts I've missed during this damp squib of a series.


See what really gets my back up is the N word can be used quite happily between one black guy to another but if a white guy is to use the word to a black guy it's deemed offensive and racist. If they find it so offensive why the hell do they use it as a term of endearment amongst themselves.
The only difference between a white guy and black guy using it is the spelling but it still means the same. I asked one of my friends about this and she scratched her head and said i really don't know as i'm not into rap or gang culture. She's as puzzled as myself. We came to the conclusion that the black community should lead by example and omit this word from their language too.
To be honest i don't use it and i don't think i have ever called a afro/caribbean friend to her face a N...... We have a healthy jokey banter about our cultures and background etc but i've never had a slavery or N word banter with them. Infact we was discussing this issue about Emily and Charley the other day and even she said the countrys gone Mad!
GS
Gavin Scott Founding member
miss hellfire posted:
Gavin Scott posted:
James Martin posted:
Sorry to do another post but I think Mr Scott missed the point of that episode!

Gavin Scott posted:
If you want the best explanation of why then I suggest you watch the episode of South Park that Mr Martin suggested some pages back.


If you've seen that episode all the way through the episode concentrates on how Randy Marsh (Stan's dad) is consistently witch-hunted for saying The N Word live on television.

The parallels with Emily and the British Press are uncanny.

So I don't get your point about how white people don't get discriminated against,.


I'm going to have to come clean and say the last few post from me around here were "post pub", and post pub I get very absolute and, frankly, stroppy.

Racism isn't one way traffic, I accept. There are a myriad instances in our day to day lives that we are negatively dealt, and sometimes race will play a part in that. We all discriminate to everyone, all the time. Its demonstrated in our actions and by what we say.

The difference is the "n" word.

The "n" word stands for what was done to a race of people when they were slaves to white people. Its dehumanising. You can't get away from that. Whatever year it currently is when you are reading this, that's what it means.

As words go its pretty powerful, and as we learn in South Park, "it doesn't matter if you said it by accident, it's still a big deal ".

Beyond any broadcasting scenario, Emily broke a social taboo. The "n" word might have a contemporary understanding within your posse or family, but she was out of her comfort zone. To use the word without a tacit frame of reference was just odd.

The conclusion of the South Park story wasn't Randy's "victimisation", it is Stan coming to realise that as a white person he will never understand why black people are so upset by the word, and why it can make black people mad when a white person says it in any context.

This may be a little off topic, but its certainly relevant to what went on last week, and I'm using up all the posts I've missed during this damp squib of a series.


See what really gets my back up is the N word can be used quite happily between one black guy to another but if a white guy is to use the word to a black guy it's deemed offensive and racist. If they find it so offensive why the hell do they use it as a term of endearment amongst themselves.
The only difference between a white guy and black guy using it is the spelling but it still means the same. I asked one of my friends about this and she scratched her head and said i really don't know as i'm not into rap or gang culture. She's as puzzled as myself. We came to the conclusion that the black community should lead by example and omit this word from their language too.
To be honest i don't use it and i don't think i have ever called a afro/caribbean friend to her face a N...... We have a healthy jokey banter about our cultures and background etc but i've never had a slavery or N word banter with them. Infact we was discussing this issue about Emily and Charley the other day and even she said the countrys gone Mad!


Its no different to the way that the gay community dealt with "faggot". It's an attempt to take the sting out of the word and remove some of its power.

I'm not sure why you would particularly want to use the words "n*****" or "faggot".

Why would you be jealous of what is essentially a coping technique?
:-(
A former member
Carole, Tracey and Shabnam face the public vote this week. - This doesnt need to be in a spoiler tag does it?
MH
miss hellfire
Oh i'm not jealous! I wouldn't want to use either terms anyway. I have a much wider vocabularly without un-intentionally offending.
I just didn't understand why black on black can say it and it's a term of brotherhood yet white to black cannot say it without fearing being a racist?
I've never used the term faggot towards a gay bloke either.

However if blacks and homosexulas use those terms amongst themselves to remove the sting of the word why are the words still deemed offensive to them if uttered by those who are neither Gay nor black?

Or is just those who are not black or gay have now decided that those words will and always will be derogative regardles of the how the black and gay community now percieve i them or handled it themselves.

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