EX
Apart from possibly the Olympics if they were held in Asia when would this be an issue? No other sporting event is usually on 2 channels at once overnight at I can't think the of the last time the BBC had two different sporting events clashing at 5am in the morning
BBC2 needs to be available though to the BBC 24 hours a day for it's sporting output such as the Olympics, Wimbledon, Snooker and various other events periodically throughout the year. BBC1 and the Red Button (which is just one stream on Freeview) could not cover them adequately enough without BBC2.
Apart from possibly the Olympics if they were held in Asia when would this be an issue? No other sporting event is usually on 2 channels at once overnight at I can't think the of the last time the BBC had two different sporting events clashing at 5am in the morning
NG
The only current way of doing an optional BSL sign-language would be broadcasting the show on two channels simultaneously and using an additional video stream - like 301 - which you switched to dynamically - possibly using a Press Red style interface.
Any signed content would also need to be available as a normal channel with EPG data (which 301 has I believe?) so that you could record the signed version or the unsigned version for later viewing. The signed version will still take up the full bandwith of an additional broadcast channel - as you still have to do the signer+programme composite construction prior to broadcast, not in the set top box or IDTV.
Although technically it is obviously feasible to design a standard that would allow the signer to be sent separately and composited in the box AIUI this is still a way off - and the costs to both broadcasters and consumers (special boxes are likely to be required unless the government mandates all receivers have the facility from a certain date) are likely to mean it isn't pursued.
Work was done on a virtual avatar signer - but this was for SSE (Simple Signed English) not BSL (British Sign Language), and AIUI BSL is much more complex and nuanced, requiring facial expressions and body movement to be accurately reproduced. SSE is not the mainstream sign language used in the UK (and like English subtitles would be considered a second language for many BSL users - a bit like hearing people having to watch programmes dubbed into French)
noggin
Founding member
After DSO i'm assuming they can have a dedicated Sign Language Red Button? A BSL button, that you can press when the programme is enabled? Like Subtitles? This is surely not beyond our capabilities? Yes there are programmes that you wouldnt want to repeat before the watershed, but why cant Daytime be repeats of Pre-Watershed Primetime?
The only current way of doing an optional BSL sign-language would be broadcasting the show on two channels simultaneously and using an additional video stream - like 301 - which you switched to dynamically - possibly using a Press Red style interface.
Any signed content would also need to be available as a normal channel with EPG data (which 301 has I believe?) so that you could record the signed version or the unsigned version for later viewing. The signed version will still take up the full bandwith of an additional broadcast channel - as you still have to do the signer+programme composite construction prior to broadcast, not in the set top box or IDTV.
Although technically it is obviously feasible to design a standard that would allow the signer to be sent separately and composited in the box AIUI this is still a way off - and the costs to both broadcasters and consumers (special boxes are likely to be required unless the government mandates all receivers have the facility from a certain date) are likely to mean it isn't pursued.
Work was done on a virtual avatar signer - but this was for SSE (Simple Signed English) not BSL (British Sign Language), and AIUI BSL is much more complex and nuanced, requiring facial expressions and body movement to be accurately reproduced. SSE is not the mainstream sign language used in the UK (and like English subtitles would be considered a second language for many BSL users - a bit like hearing people having to watch programmes dubbed into French)
WE
For the amount of 'opt out' programming, other than news, sport & current affairs, why have regional BBC One English Regions after DSO?
As I mentioned on the Midlands thread, there is an opt out on late Saturday night(which also involves the 2 Yorkshire regions & the South & SE regions too!), but how often do we get this sort of opt out? Very rare IMO.
Surely the regional streams would be better used on the News Channel, then BBC One & BBC Two can please themselves?
(Keep the Nations as they have more regional programming than the English regions, but would you keep regional news on BBC One in the Nations & have a radically different schedule for BBC One England at that point, or provide another 3 feeds for 'News Channel Scotland' etc. I'm also assuming the current default NC feed would become the 'regional' London feed too!)
As I mentioned on the Midlands thread, there is an opt out on late Saturday night(which also involves the 2 Yorkshire regions & the South & SE regions too!), but how often do we get this sort of opt out? Very rare IMO.
Surely the regional streams would be better used on the News Channel, then BBC One & BBC Two can please themselves?
(Keep the Nations as they have more regional programming than the English regions, but would you keep regional news on BBC One in the Nations & have a radically different schedule for BBC One England at that point, or provide another 3 feeds for 'News Channel Scotland' etc. I'm also assuming the current default NC feed would become the 'regional' London feed too!)
CH
The Politics Show? Inside Out?
How on Earth will changing the opting channel from BBC One to the News Channel actually have any benefits? Surely leaving it on BBC One gives more scope for opting if it is needed.
For the amount of 'opt out' programming, other than news, sport & current affairs, why have regional BBC One English Regions after DSO?
As I mentioned on the Midlands thread, there is an opt out on late Saturday night(which also involves the 2 Yorkshire regions & the South & SE regions too!), but how often do we get this sort of opt out? Very rare IMO.
Surely the regional streams would be better used on the News Channel, then BBC One & BBC Two can please themselves?
(Keep the Nations as they have more regional programming than the English regions, but would you keep regional news on BBC One in the Nations & have a radically different schedule for BBC One England at that point, or provide another 3 feeds for 'News Channel Scotland' etc. I'm also assuming the current default NC feed would become the 'regional' London feed too!)
As I mentioned on the Midlands thread, there is an opt out on late Saturday night(which also involves the 2 Yorkshire regions & the South & SE regions too!), but how often do we get this sort of opt out? Very rare IMO.
Surely the regional streams would be better used on the News Channel, then BBC One & BBC Two can please themselves?
(Keep the Nations as they have more regional programming than the English regions, but would you keep regional news on BBC One in the Nations & have a radically different schedule for BBC One England at that point, or provide another 3 feeds for 'News Channel Scotland' etc. I'm also assuming the current default NC feed would become the 'regional' London feed too!)
The Politics Show? Inside Out?
How on Earth will changing the opting channel from BBC One to the News Channel actually have any benefits? Surely leaving it on BBC One gives more scope for opting if it is needed.
BR
Most non-news regional output in England at least tends to be news related and would fit neatly into the News Channel schedule - the only main exception IMO is The Super League Show, but that should be nationalised anyway IMO.
As I said earlier I think there is a strong case for regionalising the news channel and it would arguably enable the BBC to offer a better regional news service in terms of the output - but the counter argument is it would almost certainly see the reach of the regional news reduced - I can't see 6-7m people suddenly watching the News Channel at 6.30pm. And also, there is nothing BBC1 could show really which would get the same size audience in place of it.
As I said earlier I think there is a strong case for regionalising the news channel and it would arguably enable the BBC to offer a better regional news service in terms of the output - but the counter argument is it would almost certainly see the reach of the regional news reduced - I can't see 6-7m people suddenly watching the News Channel at 6.30pm. And also, there is nothing BBC1 could show really which would get the same size audience in place of it.
DV
Regionalising the news channel would offer the regions the chance to do breaking news themselves for their own region while the national team work on the story for the rest of the country, with each pulling on each other's footage as and when necessary. Imagine stories such as Cumbria's shootings last year or floods the year before covered under this model.
However, it doesn't take long then before the question begins to be asked if there should be any news on BBC One or BBC Two at all.
However, it doesn't take long then before the question begins to be asked if there should be any news on BBC One or BBC Two at all.
DO
I'm sorry, but regionalising the News Channel would be an awful idea. Lets look at the pros and cons:
Pros:
- Regions can do breaking news for themselves
- Urmmm....
Cons:
- Restricts regions to only doing news programming
- Stops the News Channel from being able to run with breaking news
- Would decimate regional news ratings
- Would require BBC One to find something to fill 6.30-7pm which doesn't compete with the regional news
For me, the biggest reason this idea is stupid is that it stops the regions from being able to do any form of non-news programming. In the Yorkshire region last year we had two or three documentaries, broadcast at prime time, which weren't really of national interest - any changes to the regions broadcast structure should not remove the ability to do this, and I would like it if the regions were encouraged to do more of this non-news stuff.
It's almost as stupid and unlikely idea as BBC Two broadcasting the News Channel all day, and that's not going to happen either.
Pros:
- Regions can do breaking news for themselves
- Urmmm....
Cons:
- Restricts regions to only doing news programming
- Stops the News Channel from being able to run with breaking news
- Would decimate regional news ratings
- Would require BBC One to find something to fill 6.30-7pm which doesn't compete with the regional news
For me, the biggest reason this idea is stupid is that it stops the regions from being able to do any form of non-news programming. In the Yorkshire region last year we had two or three documentaries, broadcast at prime time, which weren't really of national interest - any changes to the regions broadcast structure should not remove the ability to do this, and I would like it if the regions were encouraged to do more of this non-news stuff.
It's almost as stupid and unlikely idea as BBC Two broadcasting the News Channel all day, and that's not going to happen either.
NG
However, it doesn't take long then before the question begins to be asked if there should be any news on BBC One or BBC Two at all.
I think the answer to that question is in the ratings. People don't watch the News Channel anywhere near as much as they watch BBC One - even when the same news programme is on both outlets.
The BBC One 1830 Regional News bulletin is the most watched news programme in Britain - and is likely to remain on BBC One for that very reason. If it were on the News Channel it would be amazing if it got 10% of the audience it gets on BBC One.
There is a myth that when channels are universally available they are universally viewed. That isn't the case. Put the same programme on two different networks and you won't get the same audiences.
noggin
Founding member
However, it doesn't take long then before the question begins to be asked if there should be any news on BBC One or BBC Two at all.
I think the answer to that question is in the ratings. People don't watch the News Channel anywhere near as much as they watch BBC One - even when the same news programme is on both outlets.
The BBC One 1830 Regional News bulletin is the most watched news programme in Britain - and is likely to remain on BBC One for that very reason. If it were on the News Channel it would be amazing if it got 10% of the audience it gets on BBC One.
There is a myth that when channels are universally available they are universally viewed. That isn't the case. Put the same programme on two different networks and you won't get the same audiences.
IS
It would cost a bit operationally though. The regions are staffed and resourced for the regular bulletins - Breakfast, 1:30, 3:00, 6:30 and 10:30. To have a team that's ready to go to air all day increases the costs quite substantially
Regionalising the news channel would offer the regions the chance to do breaking news themselves for their own region while the national team work on the story for the rest of the country,
It would cost a bit operationally though. The regions are staffed and resourced for the regular bulletins - Breakfast, 1:30, 3:00, 6:30 and 10:30. To have a team that's ready to go to air all day increases the costs quite substantially
DV
This story has been around for five days now, significantly NO mainstream daily newspapers have taken the story along, even moreso that Media Guardian hasn't mentioned it, also no comment from the BBC in either way has been made. Some clarity to indie producers, if this story 'had wheels', would have been needed by now to placate their business plans.
I think we can dismiss it for now as over-active imaginative speculation, that got into the wild.
Not withstanding the above, some limited changes to BBC TWO are inevitable in the context of the Licence fee review.
I think we can dismiss it for now as over-active imaginative speculation, that got into the wild.
Not withstanding the above, some limited changes to BBC TWO are inevitable in the context of the Licence fee review.