With an extended Cbeebies/CBBC block til noon, a longer Daily Politics could there be enough built content from the News Channel, and the World News Channel? Things like Click, HardTalk, Reporters.
Add in BookTalk from BBC Parliament and some `showcase` repeats of BBC 4 content, surely that would be enough to form an intelligent schedule until 6pm?
With an extended Cbeebies/CBBC block til noon, a longer Daily Politics could there be enough built content from the News Channel, and the World News Channel? Things like Click, HardTalk, Reporters.
Add in BookTalk from BBC Parliament and some `showcase` repeats of BBC 4 content, surely that would be enough to form an intelligent schedule until 6pm?
Even if thing aren't as drastic as replacing the daytime schedule on BBC2 with a News Channel simulcast, extending the Daily Politics is what the show needs. Especially on Mondays, Tuesdays, Thursdays and Fridays when the programme is just 30 minutes long where they have quite a few segments, but not enough time to do each subject justice, especially when the guests will frequently talk over each other. The Daily Politics on those days needs to be extended to at least 45 minutes, if not an hour.
Turning BBC Two off from 4am to 6pm (post DSO) will save the most money possible from this proposal. Heck, the BBC could even sublet the hours of Freeview to turn a profit.
It's not just BBC Two this could apply to. BBC Parliament and even BBC Three/Four after say 2am. Would still leave the BBC News Channel plus BBC1 for any overnight sport or live events that occasionally happen
However the likely channels interested in overnight space on freeview would be teleshopping, gambling and porn. In PR terms selling space to such channels might not be such a good idea, whatever the financial merit maybe
I don't understand the obsession with merging CBBC and Cbeebies.
If you had kids, you would know the fact that these are two different channels for two different audiences. Younger kids don't understand CBBC. Older kids don't want to watch Cbeebies.
Exactly - perhaps BBC2 could go CBBC retro - classic kids shows for the parents! (Indeed they have with The Flintstones and Top Cat etc. during the day in recent years).
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And since ITV appear to have given up on kids telly, there is a place for the BBC doing this.
Also, it is in the long term interest of CBBC, Cbeebies and BBC News to stop the simulcasts once DSO is complete. This gets people used to typing 80 or 503 for BBC News, rather than 2 or 102, which is only available for a small part of the day. Guiding people to the specialist channels will drive audience growth, throughout all 24 hours, not just for a few, something simulcasting cannot achieve.
You contradict yourself there - shunting all kids shows to CBBC/CBeebies would be falling into exactly the same trap as ITV. I do think though there is an argument to reduce content on BBC1/2 - firstly because I think viewing figures suggest kids go straight to the channels anyway, but secondly because their slots on BBC1/2 should be to showcase the flagship content, not rescreen a ton of repeats. It goes against the topic of this thread but other than cost there is little justification for four hours of CBeebies on BBC2 every morning, and CBBC would arguably benefit from a more focused slot in the schedule - even as little as half an hour for just flagship shows. I would like to see the Saturday morning shows reinstated on BBC1 though - something the BBC Trust recommended a year or two ago, something the BBC ignored. Saturday Kitchen can then be axed and reworked as a daily show, killing two birds with one stone.
Also there is absolutely no justification for removing the news from BBC1 - indeed the news can often be one of the highest rated shows of the day. For PSB reasons there is little reason to move the regional news, especially as the combined ratings of the 6.30pm bulletins often tops 7m. However, should the News Channel ever be made the regionalised channel for the BBC in the future I would think they could cater for local news audiences better there than they can on BBC1 - and it really would differentiate the BBC News Channel from it's competitors.
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There is also way too much substitution on this thread. Doing something else may save some money. Like all things in life, the best way to reduce cost is to stop doing things at all. Turning BBC Two off from 4am to 6pm (post DSO) will save the most money possible from this proposal. Heck, the BBC could even sublet the hours of Freeview to turn a profit.
BBC2 needs to be available though to the BBC 24 hours a day for it's sporting output such as the Olympics, Wimbledon, Snooker and various other events periodically throughout the year. BBC1 and the Red Button (which is just one stream on Freeview) could not cover them adequately enough without BBC2.
Exactly - perhaps BBC2 could go CBBC retro - classic kids shows for the parents! (Indeed they have with The Flintstones and Top Cat etc. during the day in recent years).
I would like to see the Saturday morning shows reinstated on BBC1 though - something the BBC Trust recommended a year or two ago, something the BBC ignored. Saturday Kitchen can then be axed and reworked as a daily show, killing two birds with one stone.
I think its a shame there aren't any big Saturday morning shows anymore. From ITV's perspective it is understandable because of the cost involved, but aside from ratings and entertainment it did provide a good spring board for presenters to make it to prime time. Some of the biggest presenters around today and in the last decade have emerged through Saturday morning TV- Ant & Dec, Cat Deeley, Holly Willoughby, Fearne Cotton and even dating back to the 80s with Phillip Schofield. Todays TV 'talent' tends to be stuck in a rut because there are no big names coming through anymore, Caroline Flack is the last of the Saturday morning TV alumni and she hasn't made it that big yet. However thats a different argument for another time.
Also there is absolutely no justification for removing the news from BBC1 - indeed the news can often be one of the highest rated shows of the day. For PSB reasons there is little reason to move the regional news, especially as the combined ratings of the 6.30pm bulletins often tops 7m. However, should the News Channel ever be made the regionalised channel for the BBC in the future I would think they could cater for local news audiences better there than they can on BBC1 - and it really would differentiate the BBC News Channel from it's competitors.
I remember reading they physically can't regionalise BBC2 which is why regional news is never moved to BBC2 in favour of sport, and I assume it is the same for the news channel too. There is no point in moving the national news off BBC1 when the regional news needs to stay there as part of PSB. Besides, news bulletins on BBC1 (and ITV1, C4 and C5 for that matter) are different to the news channels because it's a structured round up of the days news, and it could get lost on a rolling news channel. I imagine if they were solely on the news channels then they'd get lost amongst the rolling news and people would begin to rely on internet sources.
I think its a shame there aren't any big Saturday morning shows anymore. From ITV's perspective it is understandable because of the cost involved, but aside from ratings and entertainment it did provide a good spring board for presenters to make it to prime time. Some of the biggest presenters around today and in the last decade have emerged through Saturday morning TV- Ant & Dec, Cat Deeley, Holly Willoughby, Fearne Cotton and even dating back to the 80s with Phillip Schofield. Todays TV 'talent' tends to be stuck in a rut because there are no big names coming through anymore, Caroline Flack is the last of the Saturday morning TV alumni and she hasn't made it that big yet. However thats a different argument for another time.
Exactly.
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I remember reading they physically can't regionalise BBC2 which is why regional news is never moved to BBC2 in favour of sport, and I assume it is the same for the news channel too. There is no point in moving the national news off BBC1 when the regional news needs to stay there as part of PSB. Besides, news bulletins on BBC1 (and ITV1, C4 and C5 for that matter) are different to the news channels because it's a structured round up of the days news, and it could get lost on a rolling news channel. I imagine if they were solely on the news channels then they'd get lost amongst the rolling news and people would begin to rely on internet sources.
Yes, for the BBC to regionalise the news channel it would mean removing the regionalisation of BBC1. Although on Freeview it's not a problem, with Sky every region requires an extra channel stream - so regionalisation soon gets expensive. Perhaps with most TVs now with built in Freeview there is an argument for assuming Freeview is the base for every viewer and Sky/Cable is just an add on as it used to be. I'd imagine that would save all the main PSBs a heck of a lot of cash.
And since ITV appear to have given up on kids telly, there is a place for the BBC doing this.
You contradict yourself there - shunting all kids shows to CBBC/CBeebies would be falling into exactly the same trap as ITV.
Actually, I just did not explain things very well. Unless things have changed recently, ITV have given up making children's programmes. I meant nothing about the CITV channel, which is a good idea, and would be better with more funding.
Also there is absolutely no justification for removing the news from BBC1 - indeed the news can often be one of the highest rated shows of the day. For PSB reasons there is little reason to move the regional news, especially as the combined ratings of the 6.30pm bulletins often tops 7m.
There is an argument for leaving the 1, 6 and 10 on BBC One, but not for leaving longer simulcasts in place.
However, should the News Channel ever be made the regionalised channel for the BBC in the future I would think they could cater for local news audiences better there than they can on BBC1 - and it really would differentiate the BBC News Channel from it's competitors.
Now that is a really interesting idea. Local news optouts on the News Channel.
There is also way too much substitution on this thread. Doing something else may save some money. Like all things in life, the best way to reduce cost is to stop doing things at all. Turning BBC Two off from 4am to 6pm (post DSO) will save the most money possible from this proposal. Heck, the BBC could even sublet the hours of Freeview to turn a profit.
BBC2 needs to be available though to the BBC 24 hours a day for it's sporting output such as the Olympics, Wimbledon, Snooker and various other events periodically throughout the year. BBC1 and the Red Button (which is just one stream on Freeview) could not cover them adequately enough without BBC2.
Do you think there is the financial justification to leave a channel empty on Freeview for such a low amount of usage through the year, when there is 301 available 24/7 already, and youview should be around then? (Obviously, satellite and cable have a lower cost per channel, so these can be left available)
Yes - certainly more justification than scaling BBC2 back to a level not seen since it's launch and selling off the airtime to a company likely to offer absolutely nothing of PSB value to the licence fee payer.
DS
Dan S
Well if the BBC News Channel is going to start being represented to a wider audience on BBC Two, let's hope we start to see some more presenters standing up and the BARCO's being used to their full potential - amongst other things
Do you think there is the financial justification to leave a channel empty on Freeview for such a low amount of usage through the year, when there is 301 available 24/7 already, and youview should be around then? (Obviously, satellite and cable have a lower cost per channel, so these can be left available)
The real justification is, in 2011, can they justify not keeping a PSB on air 24/7?
Well if the BBC News Channel is going to start being represented to a wider audience on BBC Two, let's hope we start to see some more presenters standing up and the BARCO's being used to their full potential - amongst other things
Do you do this to wind people up? Surely there must be a rule on TV Forum that can stop things like this? It's getting beyond a joke when you emerge in other threads.
Simulcast the News Channel during the daytime on BBC 2? Why? In an emergency they usually interrupt BBC 1, more viewers. Why would they do it? It's a stupid suggestion.
Assuming this wont happen til DSO is complete in about 18 months time. Why are they even bothering to tell us? and why are they so LAZY and FECKLESS that they cant overhaul the daytime schedule of one channel? Oh yeah sorry BBC 1 is just as bad. Even so, how can showing the equivilent of NOTHING, by duplicating another channel, be better than what we've got at the moment?
NO to NEWS - there is already a news channel which EVERYBODY WILL HAVE and probably has less viewers in the daytime than BBC Two even if you dont include those who havent switched yet.
NO to KIDS - there are already TWO childrens channels which EVERYBODY WILL HAVE. Kids are more likely to be Tech Savvy and changing channels wont be a problem for them. Besides, dedicated childrens channels are BETTER than segments on another channel.
Why cant they repeat, say... Strictly Come Dancing on a Monday afternoon after GMT? You're sorted til 3pm then. What about all those good factual programmes that are wasted during the overnights? (Not Hardtalk or any of those rubbish news channel fillers) What about that MASSIVE back catalogue of excellent programming that doesnt see repeat? Yeah so what if UKTV airs it occasionally it will get more viewers in Daytime on BBC 1 & 2.
After DSO i'm assuming they can have a dedicated Sign Language Red Button? A BSL button, that you can press when the programme is enabled? Like Subtitles? This is surely not beyond our capabilities? Yes there are programmes that you wouldnt want to repeat before the watershed, but why cant Daytime be repeats of Pre-Watershed Primetime?
Yes by all means axe the Horrible programming, but to simulcast a news channel on what is the UK's third(or fourth) most popular channel, in the name of cost cutting is just ridiculous.
