I think the need to have box saying BBC TWO is not necessary. The 2 is so distinctive that it can be shown on its own in my view. I think TEXT and a box distracts from the great 2 a little.
BBC Two's problem is that they give you too much identity on the screen whereas Channel 4 doesn't bother to tell you what channel you're on at all.
I get that BBC 2 have various regions - but less is more (not in a Channel 4 way you understand)
BBC Two's problem is that they give you too much identity on the screen whereas Channel 4 doesn't bother to tell you what channel you're on at all.
Neither of which is a good idea really. Would you say the 1997 look was overboard with "BBC Two" at the bottom rather than in a box?
MR
mr_vivian
I didn't mind the BBC TWO text back then as there was no box around it. The addition of the box really grated on me when the yellow 2 came.
The difference between 1997 and 2015 is that we are now in the digital area where we have an epg to tell us the name of the channel.
The BBC 2 logo is pretty distinctive by now. There was actually a period where there was only the BBC initials under the 2 originally and it worked just fine.
I seem to recall somebody from the BBC complained to Lambie Nairn that their channels didn't have a proper logo, hence the boxes were introduced. The strange thing is they've become the most inconsistent staple of the BBC's identity. I've seen the current BBC One and Three logos stuck in a box on promos and they don't even use boxes anymore. The sooner they completely disappear, the better.
I seem to recall somebody from the BBC complained to Lambie Nairn that their channels didn't have a proper logo, hence the boxes were introduced. The strange thing is they've become the most inconsistent staple of the BBC's identity. I've seen the current BBC One and Three logos stuck in a box on promos and they don't even use boxes anymore. The sooner they completely disappear, the better.
Amen to that!
I love the fact that somebody complained to Lambie Nairne about branding. I mean Lambie Nairne don't have experience in the field or anything *shakes head*
I seem to recall somebody from the BBC complained to Lambie Nairn that their channels didn't have a proper logo, hence the boxes were introduced. The strange thing is they've become the most inconsistent staple of the BBC's identity. I've seen the current BBC One and Three logos stuck in a box on promos and they don't even use boxes anymore. The sooner they completely disappear, the better.
Amen to that!
I love the fact that somebody complained to Lambie Nairne about branding. I mean Lambie Nairne don't have experience in the field or anything *shakes head*
Hmmm I'm not sure we can say that the 1997 Gill Sans only logos would look great now in 2015. The BBC were quite lucky that apps on phones are now presented in boxes, meaning things like the BBC News app can have the same logo on mobile and on-screen.
Remember Lambie-Nairn's idea was the channel would be identified by the ident itself, not the logo. That works fine on television, not so online.
I seem to recall somebody from the BBC complained to Lambie Nairn that their channels didn't have a proper logo, hence the boxes were introduced. The strange thing is they've become the most inconsistent staple of the BBC's identity. I've seen the current BBC One and Three logos stuck in a box on promos and they don't even use boxes anymore. The sooner they completely disappear, the better.
Amen to that!
I love the fact that somebody complained to Lambie Nairne about branding. I mean Lambie Nairne don't have experience in the field or anything *shakes head*
Hmmm I'm not sure we can say that the 1997 Gill Sans only logos would look great now in 2015. The BBC were quite lucky that apps on phones are now presented in boxes, meaning things like the BBC News app can have the same logo on mobile and on-screen.
Remember Lambie-Nairn's idea was the channel would be identified by the ident itself, not the logo. That works fine on television, not so online.
I thought the box logos were just a variation on the previous alternative, stacked versions of the 1997 logos with a solid coloured background behind them. They were used when the standard horizontal strip logos couldn't be used, or a stacked logo was preferable. For example, BBC World:
And I don't think Lambie-Nairn's idea was that the channel's personality would be shown solely by the ident itself - because that doesn't work for things like the radio stations or brands that won't have TV idents. The idea was that the surrounding branding or marketing would show off the personality, rather than trying to stuff all the personality into an unsightly logo (see Children's BBC).
Yeah, actually in terms of consistency, the box logos in the 2001-3 rebrand period weren't bad at all. They led to nice 'across the BBC' cross-promotion slides and end boards for trailers. And I don't think they looked too unsightly - giving each channel a colour wasn't a bad idea. Whilst there are reasonable grounds to dislike the new BBC One and BBC Two identities that came with the box logos, I don't think the logos themselves were a bad idea. As Martin L-N has said himself, he was striving to maintain consistency and this was the 'next step' for a BBC who wanted more of a 'logo' for their channels.
Of course, the transition into the boxes led to cross-promotion stuff looking pretty terrible (between February and late-March 2002, when BBC Two and BBC Four had box logos, with BBC One and BBC Choice having the strip logos, with the BBC Choice strip logo lasting until 2003) - there's one capture I've seen that just looks silly. But that's inevitable when you're transitioning identities without doing a big 'switch' one day.
It was from 2006, when BBC One rebranded, that the box inconsistencies became bad. For the last nine years (!!) there hasn't been a consistent cross-promotion device. The boxes are still used for this purpose, but that's a fudge, as BBC One and BBC Three's identities don't use a box ordinarily. The BBC Two box that came with the 2007 identity was needless, too, and they'd have done better to integrate a logo somewhere else within the idents. Obviously the BBC Four box is integral to that ident set, but it was perhaps short-sighted to commission them just 12 months ahead of a change of direction for the BBC One brand? So we have the boxes used for some cross channel stuff, with logos that don't really fit them and that don't match up to any of the rest of the presentation.
Then you get some end boards that don't use the boxes and instead use the stripped/stacked logos in a variety of ways. It looks terrible. Plus, BBC Sport use the boxes but really small and squashed on their promos and pointer straps - that looks poor too.
They've kind-of-but-not-quite restored consistency with having each channel use a stripped logo at the bottom centre of the screen during trailers - that's nice and works well. What they need to do now is find a better cross-channel promotion tool using these stripped logos.
But, frankly, given the mess that the BBC's pres is in presently, that's quite a forlorn hope. They'd almost be better off 'doing an ITV' and revamping the identities of all the TV channels together, settling on a new 'corporate' style with the different channels' personalities contained within. But they obviously can't do that, given the licence fee constraints.
The solution to the BBC's branding woes could be as simple as bringing all the on-air identities under one strict formula. The channel logo in the bottom right corner (exactly the same size for each channel). In addition, the endboards of promos and signposts (I think they're called menus in the UK) should be identical across BBC One, Two and Four, with the only difference being the colour - red and white for One, teal for Two, black/yellow for Four, which is the same colour as the logo boxes. Replace the mix-mash of fonts used on BBC One, Two and Four with Gill Sans for all programme names and times/dates.