BBC Three

They could have BBC Four start at 9pm (and rename it - it is daft to have Four without Three), and CBBC and Cbeebies swap frequencies (but not channel numbers). That way, Cbeebies gets a one hour extension, CBBC gets a two hour extension, and BBC One+1 would start at 8pm. No need for Red Button swappage then.

Seriously hoping that BBC FOUR takes the HD slot vacated so ALL Freeview viewers have it in HD. BBC ONE +1 HD can go on the restricted mux.

I'm probably going to sound really stupid now as everyone else seems to understand, but why couldn't BBC One +1 have a full 24hr channel and CBBC still running until 9pm with the change.

Is it just there isn't channel/frequency capacity? This is the side of TV I struggle to understand

BBC Three and CBBC are on the same stream, they come from the same gallery, and basically, any change made to one would have an effect on the other. CBeebies and BBC Four are in the same position. So the idea of taking BBC Three off from broadcast television gives it free reign to have a 24 hour stream, and through iPlayer, all the 'catch-up' shows as well.

It's a mix of lack of gallery, but also lack of capacity on Freeview.

I'm pretty sure a "24 hour stream" would still need at least a rudimentary gallery or playout system - the "24 hour" thing is a red herring; it's only going to be 24 hours in the same way that Cbeebies is available 24 hours via iPlayer.

Exactly - they're trying to make it look like they'll be more content but they'll just be less.

It's just a shame the BBC Trust is probably not to be trusted when it comes to BBC3 as the proposals put forward for closing it are far less convincing than the proposals for closing 6 Music and Asian Network were.

Its doubeful there will be less? BBC3 only has new content 90mins per day. The rest is just repeats and US cartoons and films.

The BBC (*) share two SD and two HD vision and sound streams for CBBC/BBC Three and CBeebies/BBC Four. Although they are mapped to different channel numbers on your receiver, the actual pictures and sound for CBBC and BBC Three use the same space on the BBC's multiplexes or transponders (the bits of DTT and DSat that are used for broadcast).

There is only space for a finite number of simultaneous sound and vision services in a given space on DTT and DSat, if you try to increase the number you will reduce picture quality)

This means that CBBC can't broadcast at the same time as BBC Three, and CBeebies can't broadcast at the same time as BBC Four. If the BBC wanted to make the services 24 hours a day they'd need twice as much space for the channels on DTT and DSat which would increase costs (and in the case of DTT, at one point wasn't possible)

(*) They were able to make BBC Three 24 hours a day by swapping it with a Red Button channel, when they wanted to run it for extended sports coverage. This meant that the Red Button channel wasn't able to broadcast when CBBC was on-air.

To essentially repeat what noggin has just said currently the space is used as follows (assuming I recall correctly)...
* BBC One (all day)
* BBC One HD (all day)
* BBC Two (all day)
* BBC Two HD (all day)
* CBBC (7am-7pm) & BBC Three (7pm-7am)
* CBBC HD (7am-7pm) & BBC Three HD (7pm-7am)
* CBeebies (7am-7pm) & BBC Four (7pm-7am)
* CBeebies HD (7am-7pm) & BBC Four HD (7pm-7am)
* BBC News Channel
* BBC News Channel HD
* BBC Parliament
* BBC Red Button

Assuming the channel sharing remains the same the proposed changes would mean...
* CBBC (7am-9pm) & "BBC One +1" (9pm-7am)
* CBBC HD (7am-9pm) & "BBC One +1 HD" (9pm-7am)

Personally I don't see a "BBC One+1 HD" channel to be likely. Similarly I'd have also thought that they would want to make the +1 channel a 24 hour service, so that it could show more than just from 8pm onwards nightly. The easiest way to do this would be for BBC One+1 to broadcast using the space currently occupied by the red button.

You can do a 24 hour stream of video files on a computer, and output that online, without needing a gallery, just a piece of playout and scheduling software. One single computer can do that, and the technology to do that has been around for about 10 years.

BBC Three is definitely not going to be a stream. The programmes are just going to be added to iPlayer daily, no playout facilities/countinuity announcers etc. will be required. It essentially is getting rid of the channel completely but keeping the name to fool people into thinking the service exists as is but online. It won't. I imagine the same will happen to BBC FOUR in time, leaving ONE and TWO to show selected programmes from each channel as and when they wish, but the rest are left to be streamed by iPlayer only. The potential move of FOUR would leave them space to run CBBC and CBeebies 24 hours, or they could merge the channels into one 24 hour stream (say something like CBeebies - 6am to 3pm and CBBC - 3pm to 9pm) and leave the other 24 hour stream for BBC ONE+1 in full.

I don't think anyone's said there's going to be more content. The BBC have made it clear they are closing a channel and they regret that. It doesn't matter how you dress it up.



Everyone says this about merging the kids channels but if you look at the CBeebies ratings, all their top rated programmes are on after 5pm, with the Bedtime Hour a hugely popular part of people's routines. So CBeebies needs to continue after 5pm because that's clearly when people want to watch it. CBBC also gets its highest ratings at that time, so what gets priority?