« Topics
12
Mich632 posts since 24 Mar 2001
Larry Scutta posted:
Mich posted:
however with the regional BBC 2 slots, the network feed is just left in case the regions fail and need to fall back on the main feed.


Eh? What? I don't understand!


2W, TWO NI, and the lack of national service for the English.
BBC TV Centre3,106 posts since 4 Jan 2003
Quote:
It really does annoy me how that nations can have their regional stations and slots whereas the English are left aside.

Same here Evil or Very Mad

If they can't do local radio for the regions, then I think that they should bring BBC London 94.9 instead.
Robert Williams667 posts since 25 Jan 2003
Larry Scutta posted:
The big problem with providing the local english stations is just that..... they are local, not regional.

I wouldn't call Southern Counties Radio 'local'...in fact the population covered by it isn't far off that of the whole of Wales!
A former member
Robert Williams posted:
Larry Scutta posted:
The big problem with providing the local english stations is just that..... they are local, not regional.

I wouldn't call Southern Counties Radio 'local'...in fact the population covered by it isn't far off that of the whole of Wales!


It depends how you define 'local' and 'regional' of course.

Southern Counties is a very good example of why putting local radio on DTT would be problematic - it's in 2 TV regions: South and South East and it has localised opt-outs: Brighton, Sussex and Surrey.

How that would work I have no idea
A former member
Mich posted:
Larry Scutta posted:
Mich posted:
however with the regional BBC 2 slots, the network feed is just left in case the regions fail and need to fall back on the main feed.


Eh? What? I don't understand!


2W, TWO NI, and the lack of national service for the English.


Still don't understand - there is a national BBC2 service for England.

The regions don't fall back to the 'network feed'.... there are no BBC2 regions. The National BBC2s are totally seperate channels - there is no falling back except for when they cut to a direct feed from London.

Also what has this to do with Radio Wales?
Robert Williams667 posts since 25 Jan 2003
Larry Scutta posted:
Southern Counties is a very good example of why putting local radio on DTT would be problematic - it's in 2 TV regions: South and South East and it has localised opt-outs: Brighton, Sussex and Surrey.

It's actually in three TV regions - South, South East and London - at least one third of SCR's coverage area comes within the BBC London region.
Robert Williams667 posts since 25 Jan 2003
I think if local radio were to be carried on Freeview, then there would need to be at least six slots available on Mux 1 (pretty much impossible) to ensure all stations, and opt-outs, within the television region are covered, meaning many stations would have to be duplicated in different regions. So in the case of the South East area this would mean:

BBC LONDON
London
Southern Counties (Surrey)
Kent
Essex
Three Counties
Berkshire

BBC SOUTH EAST
Kent
Southern Counties (Sussex)
Southern Counties (Surrey)
Southern Counties (Brighton)

BBC SOUTH
Solent
Southern Counties (Sussex)
Southern Counties (Brighton)
Solent for Dorset
Berkshire
Wiltshire

BBC SOUTH (OXFORD)
Oxford
Berkshire
Swindon

And a similar pattern repeating across England. Nigh on impossible, in other words.
edward1,070 posts since 4 Jan 2003
If there was the slightest chance of local radio - it probably has to be done in a time schedule:-

e.g. in London they could play BBC London 94.9 for two days, then other local radio stations in London other days.

that's my opinion anyway - i hardly listen to radio stations
tvmercia3,605 posts since 16 Sep 2001
Larry Scutta posted:
Scotland and Wales have the advantage that SDN have always regionalised those areas for S4C and TeleG, so adding a couple of radio stations was easy (not sure about NI). The BBC would have to pay SDN for 40 new regional feeds to provide each station.

The BBC MUX is regional, but not local so it would take a hell of a lot of re-engineering to provide a localised station - especially where 1 DTT transmitter covers more than 1 station. There isn't the room for most of the regions to have all their stations on - some have 5 or 6 stations in their patch.

Then the other major problem is getting the output of each station to the local TV building - in some cases there is a radio station in the same building, the rest though are remote with no permanant feed except to their transmitter. This last problem is also one of the problems with putting BBC Local on Sky - getting all the stations back to London - it was difficult enough with the TV regions.

would it not be an idea to atleast put 1 local radio station per region onto DTT in the interim period? seeing as the bbc studios are located in the population centre of each region - making the largest (in population terms) station available shouldn't be *that* difficult. that would mean that a sizable chunk of england had local radio on DTT - and in some-cases (although not with WM, GMR?, GLR?) would mean that bbc regional radio late shows are also available on DTT.

they could also shift radio 3 to SDN and put the bbc local radio on the bbc's regionalised mux.

not perfect - but it would be a start!!
TVDragon2,799 posts since 4 Jan 2003
This is what I was thinking, only I couldn't find a way of expressing it properly -- for a change. The main radio station in each area would be a similar situation to Tyne Tees/Central/Anglia/Westcountry etc, who have only the larger or largest region available on 103 for news coverage.

The reasons may be different, since advertising revenue is not an issue for the BBC, but it would be something local to draw from at least. I listen a bit to radio through the tv [albeit Sky] at certain times of the week, I'm sure others do -- including hotels, which would be useful to visitors, and for clear reception, taping radio programmes in stereo etc etc.

And as has been said, a lot of the evening time gets linked up anyway.
Mark Smith207 posts since 4 Jan 2003
tvmercia posted:
Larry Scutta posted:
Scotland and Wales have the advantage that SDN have always regionalised those areas for S4C and TeleG, so adding a couple of radio stations was easy (not sure about NI). The BBC would have to pay SDN for 40 new regional feeds to provide each station.

The BBC MUX is regional, but not local so it would take a hell of a lot of re-engineering to provide a localised station - especially where 1 DTT transmitter covers more than 1 station. There isn't the room for most of the regions to have all their stations on - some have 5 or 6 stations in their patch.

Then the other major problem is getting the output of each station to the local TV building - in some cases there is a radio station in the same building, the rest though are remote with no permanant feed except to their transmitter. This last problem is also one of the problems with putting BBC Local on Sky - getting all the stations back to London - it was difficult enough with the TV regions.

would it not be an idea to atleast put 1 local radio station per region onto DTT in the interim period? seeing as the bbc studios are located in the population centre of each region - making the largest (in population terms) station available shouldn't be *that* difficult. that would mean that a sizable chunk of england had local radio on DTT - and in some-cases (although not with WM, GMR?, GLR?) would mean that bbc regional radio late shows are also available on DTT.

they could also shift radio 3 to SDN and put the bbc local radio on the bbc's regionalised mux.

not perfect - but it would be a start!!

The problem is that Radio 3 is already on SDN. Mux 1 is already full up with four TV channels, BBCi and the engineering channel so there isn't enough space for any radio channels at all. Radios 1-4 are on SDN (A) and the digital-only radio is on Mux B.

So therefore nothing can really be taken off Mux 1, unless the engineering channel is moved, but this reduces it's coverage as Mux 1 has the greatest coverage of all DTT muxes and moving the software updates might leave some people not being able to update their receivers....
A former member
There's also the problem of adding local bits to a multiplexed distribution feed. It's quite complex for BBC1