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BBC One Golf Breakdown, 23/05/09

Breakdown in golf coverage; News Channel simulcast (May 2009)

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IS
Inspector Sands
Brekkie posted:
I'm going to disagree with a lot of posts here.

Firstly, I think opting into BBC News was the obvious thing to do, although they should have had some caption on screen to explain why. Standby programmes are only really suitable if you know you won't be returning to the broadcast at all.


Not really. I don't know what the case is now but for something like live sports coverage they would schedule lots of standbys of varying lengths as well as a full length replacement (in case the event was pulled in advance) and they'd also have some short generic standbys (mostly generic run-anywhere stuff like nature ducumentaries) ready to go. With some standbys they're either short enough to run to a full length even if you might be going back in a few minutes or are suitable for dropping out of.

But going to the news channel is a quite good solution though, as it's easy to get into and out of. For those interested in the golf nothing is a suitable replacement, except perhaps radio commentary if there is some
BR
Brekkie
I guess in the old Grandstand days (when they still anchored from the studio) if they lost live coverage from on-location it would be down to Grandstand, rather than BBC1, to fill?
BU
buster
Brekkie posted:
I guess in the old Grandstand days (when they still anchored from the studio) if they lost live coverage from on-location it would be down to Grandstand, rather than BBC1, to fill?


Depends - by the end the Grandstand links all tended to be done on location at the main sporting event, so they'd be pretty stuck. But prior to about 2001, yes.
TV
TV Times
Brekkie posted:
I'm going to disagree with a lot of posts here.

Firstly, I think opting into BBC News was the obvious thing to do, although they should have had some caption on screen to explain why. Standby programmes are only really suitable if you know you won't be returning to the broadcast at all.

And secondly, I didn't think the music was bad at all. The announcer annoyed initially, stating the obvious far too often, but actually it was good to here the ident music put to good use. I agree longer cuts would have been better, but it served it's job. Remember this was an unusually lengthy breakdown too - most of the time they get back on air much quicker.


And watching it yesterday I'll reiterate the point I made about the new short idents - they could easily begin with a short BBC One logo animation (similar to the beginning of the 8pm news) on the first rift, then show action through to the second rift before having the logo form up again over the ident.


I disagree, in terms of continuity and presentation a sequence of 20 seconds of music, pause, 20 seconds of new music, pause, 20 seconds of another tune is just crass. The ident music was not put to good use as most of them don't naturally end - they just stop and sound messy, they need much longer versions or simply some decent library music ready to play.

Presentation were caught out big time yesterday - they were not prepared - Duncan who is normally very good sounded all over the place - there was certainly no need for an announcement every 20 seconds.

Crashing in and out of the news was also poor - bring back a Tom and Jerry cartoon Very Happy
SP
Steve in Pudsey
It might have been nice when the NC went to the countdown-without-numbers sequence to have gone back to BBC1 pres, with a slide and apology about the loss of golf, explain that it will be continuing on BBC2 as soon as the problems are fixed and coverage is available on 5 Live, then a few trailers and a symbol announcement into the news.
CA
cagney
Nice to see Hazel Irvine back today after having her baby, missed her on the snooker coverage this year.
LO
looknorth
TV Times posted:
The breakdown music is awful - whilst it's good to hear the ident music for breakdown purposes they surely need something better - 25 second or so pieces that kind of just stop mid flow don't sound right.


They used this tune for about 10 years on BBC1 and 2 for whenever they had breakdowns it sounds much better than looping 25 sec ident backing tracks. I dont think this is the exact version though it sounds like a modern uptake on the origional.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ew9cQgPFI0
OV
Orry Verducci
looknorth posted:
They used this tune for about 10 years on BBC1 and 2 for whenever they had breakdowns it sounds much better than looping 25 sec ident backing tracks. I dont think this is the exact version though it sounds like a modern uptake on the origional.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ew9cQgPFI0

That's Version 2, Version 1 was the exact one used by the BBC: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FS0msTgX9Yc
JU
jumpinjack
Inspector Sands posted:
Brekkie posted:
I'm going to disagree with a lot of posts here.

Firstly, I think opting into BBC News was the obvious thing to do, although they should have had some caption on screen to explain why. Standby programmes are only really suitable if you know you won't be returning to the broadcast at all.


Not really. I don't know what the case is now but for something like live sports coverage they would schedule lots of standbys of varying lengths as well as a full length replacement (in case the event was pulled in advance) and they'd also have some short generic standbys (mostly generic run-anywhere stuff like nature ducumentaries) ready to go. With some standbys they're either short enough to run to a full length even if you might be going back in a few minutes or are suitable for dropping out of.

But going to the news channel is a quite good solution though, as it's easy to get into and out of. For those interested in the golf nothing is a suitable replacement, except perhaps radio commentary if there is some


BBC1 no longer has filler programmes avaliable as channel management don't like them. In this case Pres have nothing to fill with, as was the case when Strictly Come Dancing came off early last year and were forced to fill with trails. There are standby programmes but these would be in blocks of 1/2 an hour or so not 5 minutes so you wouldn't commit to running one of these from a breakdown. You would only run a standby if coverage was going to finish early with some warning. However more often than not a live sporting event on BBC1 are requested to meet their off air time. Also a lot of OB'S these days don't carry a reserve feed due to cost mainly.
NG
noggin Founding member
jumpinjack posted:
Also a lot of OB'S these days don't carry a reserve feed due to cost mainly.


I think it depends on the situation and the profile of the event.

There are often cases where the unilateral feed doesn't have a backup, but there is a separate downlink of the multilateral, which acts as a partial back-up and ensures the main event coverage continues to be available. This is oftenthe case when the show comes via a gallery in London before it hits pres.

When sites work directly to pres then this isn't always the case.

(Though on at least one occasion I know of a full reserve path has been available, but Pres have failed to cut to it when the main circuit has failed for significant lengths of time... And in a different situation, on occasions when a studio has tried to ident their reserve feed, they've been asked what that was for...)
DE
deejay
jumpinjack posted:
Inspector Sands posted:
Brekkie posted:
I'm going to disagree with a lot of posts here.

Firstly, I think opting into BBC News was the obvious thing to do, although they should have had some caption on screen to explain why. Standby programmes are only really suitable if you know you won't be returning to the broadcast at all.


Not really. I don't know what the case is now but for something like live sports coverage they would schedule lots of standbys of varying lengths as well as a full length replacement (in case the event was pulled in advance) and they'd also have some short generic standbys (mostly generic run-anywhere stuff like nature ducumentaries) ready to go. With some standbys they're either short enough to run to a full length even if you might be going back in a few minutes or are suitable for dropping out of.

But going to the news channel is a quite good solution though, as it's easy to get into and out of. For those interested in the golf nothing is a suitable replacement, except perhaps radio commentary if there is some


BBC1 no longer has filler programmes avaliable as channel management don't like them. In this case Pres have nothing to fill with, as was the case when Strictly Come Dancing came off early last year and were forced to fill with trails. There are standby programmes but these would be in blocks of 1/2 an hour or so not 5 minutes so you wouldn't commit to running one of these from a breakdown. You would only run a standby if coverage was going to finish early with some warning. However more often than not a live sporting event on BBC1 are requested to meet their off air time. Also a lot of OB'S these days don't carry a reserve feed due to cost mainly.


Shows just how much Red Bee has become dictated to by channel management and just offering to the client what the client pays for. In years gone by, BBC Presentation would not so much tell the BBC how to run channels, but just do it - no-one argued with them. It was one of the most highly respected departments in the corporation amongst those who knew of its existance and precisely what it (a lot of people in the BBC still don't know what 'pres' is). Not being allowed to run filler programmes and yet no doubt being required to fill is madness. That said, I suppose breakdowns are not that common any more and the audience isn't actually used to seeing filler programmes any more. Unannounced Tom and Jerrys were always a bit of a bonus for me as a kid!
MA
Markymark
deejay posted:
That said, I suppose breakdowns are not that common any more and the audience isn't actually used to seeing filler programmes any more. Unannounced Tom and Jerrys were always a bit of a bonus for me as a kid!


In the 70s quite a few programmes were interrupted half way through, or just before they started by bomb scares. Sunday Night at the Palladium was blacked out several times. Also, during the seventies and the eighties there were many industrial disputes.
I remember all the hastily arranged apology captions composed with BBC R&D character generators on BBC 1 and 2. ITV companies were generally disconnected from their transmitters by the IBA, who would activate apology captions at the transmitters/ROCs.

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