ND
As far as I'm aware none of the tvs in school have aspect ratio settings - we're talking machines that pre date my arrival at the establishment - at least 10 years old. I thought it'd been on tvs really for the last 5 years or so.
DE
And of course, because of the way Schools programmes are shown onn the BBC, if you record from a DigiBox in 4:3 CCO, you won't see the curtains and will see the programme in exactly the way it was originally shown.
marksi posted:
Glad you were paying attention when the meaning of the word "sarcasm" was being taught.
If the TV's are 4:3 then you have the option of 4:3 Centre Cut Out or deep letterbox. Personally in this case I'd suggest CCO.
If the TV's are 4:3 then you have the option of 4:3 Centre Cut Out or deep letterbox. Personally in this case I'd suggest CCO.
And of course, because of the way Schools programmes are shown onn the BBC, if you record from a DigiBox in 4:3 CCO, you won't see the curtains and will see the programme in exactly the way it was originally shown.
ND
Yes, but not all schools programmes were originally transmitted 4 : 3 -surely it's better to have a 14 : 9 recording where possible so that if we did have money and could afford nice widescreen tvs so that the picture would look reasonable on that. In fact we do have one widescreen set - can be moved anywhere (hall, library, activity room and used if a tv / video breaks down in a teacher's room.) Surely 14 : 9 is what I tape from BBC 2 analogue. My problem is when I tape CBBC Class TV to get an old series which we don't have, or someone has broken one of their recording.
Agreed that videos on the way out. Southern Education & Library Board now supply recordings of educational broadcasts on DVD (though the quality of their C4 recordings is poor and BBC2 just okay - they seem to rely on analogue broadcasts). however it will be some way off before we replace 21 videos with DVD players at the moment.
Agreed that videos on the way out. Southern Education & Library Board now supply recordings of educational broadcasts on DVD (though the quality of their C4 recordings is poor and BBC2 just okay - they seem to rely on analogue broadcasts). however it will be some way off before we replace 21 videos with DVD players at the moment.
PE
Pete
Founding member
NorthDown2, do you understand how widescreen works? It's been explained earlier that to convert the old 4:3 shows into 14:9 would cut off a lot of text from these shows.
Plus if you want to watch the shows on your widescreen in fatty choppy vision then just use the functions on the TV
Plus if you want to watch the shows on your widescreen in fatty choppy vision then just use the functions on the TV
ND
Yes I do understand. (or at least I hope so 
)
My issue is when setting my Pace DTVA with a video to record the schools broadcast I have to either set it to 4:3 Letterbox (effetively the 14:9 picture used on analogue) or 4:3 centre cut out. I have no way of knowing what ratio a Monday broadcast will be broadcast in (as CBBC Class TV will broadcast programmes from 1972 to present). So if I tape 4 :3 letterbox (which i usually set it to as I don't have widescreen at home where I set the video recorders) I have frequently got the vertical blue bars with the CBBC bugs at each side (which are distracting). However if I tape 4:3 CCO and the broadcast was made to suit widescreen then the better format to tape in is surely 4:3 letterbox so that I don;t lose the extra information at the sides. Is that not correct? It's news to me that you can change aspect ratios on cheap 10 year old televisions if you do tape something wrong and get the blue bars. I know you can change the aspect ratio on a lot of newer tvs (particularly in the last 5 years) but I've never seen it in older ones and I've tuned and sorted out quite a few people's tvs over the years!
Am I getting the vertical blue bars on CBBC Class TV because of my own incompetence or because the BBC isn't sending a signal to my digibox to tell it to go to 4:3 CCO for that programme(which I've seen the box do on BBC Four programmes) Help on this appreciated.
)
My issue is when setting my Pace DTVA with a video to record the schools broadcast I have to either set it to 4:3 Letterbox (effetively the 14:9 picture used on analogue) or 4:3 centre cut out. I have no way of knowing what ratio a Monday broadcast will be broadcast in (as CBBC Class TV will broadcast programmes from 1972 to present). So if I tape 4 :3 letterbox (which i usually set it to as I don't have widescreen at home where I set the video recorders) I have frequently got the vertical blue bars with the CBBC bugs at each side (which are distracting). However if I tape 4:3 CCO and the broadcast was made to suit widescreen then the better format to tape in is surely 4:3 letterbox so that I don;t lose the extra information at the sides. Is that not correct? It's news to me that you can change aspect ratios on cheap 10 year old televisions if you do tape something wrong and get the blue bars. I know you can change the aspect ratio on a lot of newer tvs (particularly in the last 5 years) but I've never seen it in older ones and I've tuned and sorted out quite a few people's tvs over the years!
Am I getting the vertical blue bars on CBBC Class TV because of my own incompetence or because the BBC isn't sending a signal to my digibox to tell it to go to 4:3 CCO for that programme(which I've seen the box do on BBC Four programmes) Help on this appreciated.
CW
Here's a novel idea - why not do nothing alone and just show 4:3 material in 4:3, without curtains, without cropping, without anything? AIUI, it's supposed to be BBC policy to transmit 4:3 programmes with a 4:3 AFD set so that, to the viewer, it appears to be a 4:3 transmission. And that was a good policy, that way, people with 4:3 sets can see the programme the way it was meant to be shown, whilst those with widescreen sets can choose between framing/cropping/stretching themselves. Yet the BBC seem to be constantly making exceptions to it and deciding that whole blocks of programming should, in one way or the other, have all 4:3 content altered to accomodate 16:9 in some way. First it was 4:3 footage in the news, then it was the regional news programmes (many of them are produced in 4:3 but are then cropped down to 14:9), then it was CBBC blocks (and the two channels), now it's daytime. Just leave 4:3 material alone and show it the way it was made!
cwathen
Founding member
Quote:
No - it's not a technical problem - as marksi said, 4:3 Schools programmes on BBC TWO and CBBC are supposed to be shown with "curtains" within a 16:9 frame on the digital platforms. (I imagine that on analogue they are shown 4:3 centre cutout, but I may be wrong on this.) The thinking behind this was that many older schools programmes are quite text heavy and that cropping them to 14:9 (like they do with kids programmes for the CBeebies channel) would lead to things like mathematical formulae etc being chopped off.
Here's a novel idea - why not do nothing alone and just show 4:3 material in 4:3, without curtains, without cropping, without anything? AIUI, it's supposed to be BBC policy to transmit 4:3 programmes with a 4:3 AFD set so that, to the viewer, it appears to be a 4:3 transmission. And that was a good policy, that way, people with 4:3 sets can see the programme the way it was meant to be shown, whilst those with widescreen sets can choose between framing/cropping/stretching themselves. Yet the BBC seem to be constantly making exceptions to it and deciding that whole blocks of programming should, in one way or the other, have all 4:3 content altered to accomodate 16:9 in some way. First it was 4:3 footage in the news, then it was the regional news programmes (many of them are produced in 4:3 but are then cropped down to 14:9), then it was CBBC blocks (and the two channels), now it's daytime. Just leave 4:3 material alone and show it the way it was made!
NG
The DTVA displays in both 14:9 and 16:9 letterbox on its 4:3 output - however the user doesn't get to chose. The ratio of letterbox chosen is driven by the broadcast AFDs - which also drive the analogue ARCs in the analogue transmitter chains on BBC One and Two.
Stuff that is shown 14:9 letterbox on analogue is output as 14:9 letterbox by the DTVA, stuff that is 16:9 letterbox on analogue (films mainly) is output as 16:9 letterbox.
AIUI CBBC is broadcast with a permanent 14:9 active AFD so Pace DTVAs output 14:9 letterbox. (The Beeb use 14:9 active to mean 14:9 safe AIUI)
noggin
Founding member
marksi posted:
I think the Pace box does 14:9 letterbox rather than 16:9 deep letterbox, this may be the problem... it's a little too intelligent...
The DTVA displays in both 14:9 and 16:9 letterbox on its 4:3 output - however the user doesn't get to chose. The ratio of letterbox chosen is driven by the broadcast AFDs - which also drive the analogue ARCs in the analogue transmitter chains on BBC One and Two.
Stuff that is shown 14:9 letterbox on analogue is output as 14:9 letterbox by the DTVA, stuff that is 16:9 letterbox on analogue (films mainly) is output as 16:9 letterbox.
AIUI CBBC is broadcast with a permanent 14:9 active AFD so Pace DTVAs output 14:9 letterbox. (The Beeb use 14:9 active to mean 14:9 safe AIUI)