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1969 changeover from black & white to colour

One for the grey cells & our 'older' viewers ! (August 2010)

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NW
nwtv2003
RJG posted:
It was probably simulcast....BBC 2 also, if I'm not mistaken, simulcast at least one FA Cup Final, because BBC 1 was black-and-white only. The same may well have applied to Test Match cricket and Wimbledon tennis.


Yes, both the 1968 and 1969 Cup Finals were simulcast,


Probably the only times in British TV when The FA Cup Final was on BBC1, BBC2 and ITV at the same time.
MA
Malpass
RJG posted:
It was probably simulcast....BBC 2 also, if I'm not mistaken, simulcast at least one FA Cup Final, because BBC 1 was black-and-white only. The same may well have applied to Test Match cricket and Wimbledon tennis.


Yes, both the 1968 and 1969 Cup Finals were simulcast,


Probably the only times in British TV when The FA Cup Final was on BBC1, BBC2 and ITV at the same time.


Tough luck to those who hate football...
TV
tvmercia Founding member
Some information about how the distribution and OB contribution circuit arrangement at Sutton Coldfield were modified for BBC2 and colour, written by Ray Cooper who was an engineer there at the time, on the equally excellent MB21 site:

http://tx.mb21.co.uk/features/coldfield/17.shtml


very interesting article. reminds me of a clip I uploaded ages ago about the very beginnings of bbc midlands. admittedly dealing with the days long before colour, it talks about how the bbc and the gpo managed to connect birmingham, sutton coldfield and alexandra palace in the very early days...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_jbkFhtiC7M
DE
deejay
Tales from a Cold Field is a great read actually, fascinating to hear from these boys who spent their lives somewhat stuck out on the peripheries of the broadcasting empires, and yet essential to the whole business. All automated these days of course, which seems a shame somehow. There's a great tale on there about how, just after the introduction of television transmission from Sutton Coldfield, a fault with the transmitter at Alexandra Palace meant that they simply abandoned the play they were performing at the time, forgetting that the Midlands audience could still see what they were doing perfectly well!
AB
aberdeenboy
Also worth remembering that on BBC2 in the late 60s, there were a few programmes which one might normally have thought of as BBC1 programmes... even though the BBC would have insisted it was not trying to make BBC2 more popular.

I'm thinking, for instance, of Morecambe and Wise's first series for the BBC and - unbelievable as it seems now - the Black and White Minstrels. Add on The High Chaparal and sport and special events... and you actually had quite a few relatively mainstream colour programmes on 2.

However, as far as I'm aware, no actual BBC1 programmes were made in colour and shown specially on BBC2 or even repeated before their time - so it isn't as if BBC2 became a sort of "BBC Colour" channel. Programmes commissioned for BBC1 remained in black and white until the weeks leading up to the launch of BBC1 Colour, (For instance, most of the third series of Dad's Army went out "officially" in black and white although it was made in colour... including the episode which was restored to colour a few years back!)
NG
noggin Founding member
There's a great tale on there about how, just after the introduction of television transmission from Sutton Coldfield, a fault with the transmitter at Alexandra Palace meant that they simply abandoned the play they were performing at the time, forgetting that the Midlands audience could still see what they were doing perfectly well!


And thus a great BBC board question was born!
MA
Markymark
Also worth remembering that on BBC2 in the late 60s, there were a few programmes which one might normally have thought of as BBC1 programmes... even though the BBC would have insisted it was not trying to make BBC2 more popular.

I'm thinking, for instance, of Morecambe and Wise's first series for the BBC and - unbelievable as it seems now - the Black and White Minstrels.


Doesn't the Black and White Minstrel Show have the ironic distinction of being the first BBC studio production to be transmitted in colour ? I think a tennis match from Wimbledon was the very first, but it was May 67, so not the actual 'Wimbledon Fortnight' event ?
IS
Inspector Sands
Yes, Thames/LWT /ITA were broadcasting on UHF and in colour from Crystal P for some output ahead of Nov 15th, but they (and the BBC) had to be careful I think, and could only call them 'tests', because the Postmaster General 'Colour' licence for BBC 1 and ITV didn't take effect until Nov 15th.

Apparently the broadcasts of Thames and LWT on UHF Colour before the 15th November didn't have any adverts. The breaks were blacked out
TC
TonyCurrie
Couple of observations .... the odd clip of "How Television Came to the Midlands" (narrated by Sylvia Peters) was shown when Sutton Coldfield opened, but the three items that precede it on the YouTube video are from a different period; Test Card "C" didn't have the letters BBC on it until ITV opened (because there was no need to identify the channel - of course it was the BBC, what elese was there?); the Abram Games batswing Midlands ident didn't appear until 1957 and the Interlude film dates from the mid 50s. But I digress. Pedant.

Several important events were shown on both BBC-2 (in colour) and BBC-1 (in monochrome) and as well as those already identified, there was of course the Investiture of the Prince of Wales, which included Kenneth Kendall's return to the BBC as a newsreader in the lunchtime bulletin which was exceptionally shown on both channels at the same time. The FA Cup Finals that were shown in colour were not shown in Scotland, where we were entertained to our own Grandstand programme on BBC-1 and a very shoogly, mis-shapen Test Card C for the entire afternoon.

I've written about the ITV colour tests before - strictly speaking until the official launch of ITV colour, the test transmissions were made by the ITA itself, not its contractors, so although some programmes were transmitted in colour in advance of the launch (including 'The Saturday Crowd', a David Frost programme, at least one 'Coronation Street' and a couple of 'News at Ten'; these were shown without continuity and with the test card or colour bars during the commercial breaks.
MA
Matt_1979


I've written about the ITV colour tests before - strictly speaking until the official launch of ITV colour, the test transmissions were made by the ITA itself, not its contractors, so although some programmes were transmitted in colour in advance of the launch (including 'The Saturday Crowd', a David Frost programme, at least one 'Coronation Street' and a couple of 'News at Ten'; these were shown without continuity and with the test card or colour bars during the commercial breaks.


I didn't realise the ITA's test transmissions actually consisted of regular ITV programmes. I am not sure if the BBC PAL colour test transmissions were only internal - I can't remember what I read about these.
MA
Markymark


I've written about the ITV colour tests before - strictly speaking until the official launch of ITV colour, the test transmissions were made by the ITA itself, not its contractors, so although some programmes were transmitted in colour in advance of the launch (including 'The Saturday Crowd', a David Frost programme, at least one 'Coronation Street' and a couple of 'News at Ten'; these were shown without continuity and with the test card or colour bars during the commercial breaks.


I didn't realise the ITA's test transmissions actually consisted of regular ITV programmes. I am not sure if the BBC PAL colour test transmissions were only internal - I can't remember what I read about these.


Pre the 1991 Broadcasting Act, the ITA/IBA were the Broadcaster , and the ITV companies were the Programme Contractors , so if you like they (the ITA) were only using material produced for them.

If for instance the technical or artistic quality, or political balance of any ITV programme was not up to scratch the IBA could and would (though I don't think it ever happened?) cut the transmission.

For technical quality every programme and junction was monitored at IBA control centres:-

http://www.markyboy.net/ibarpt1.jpg

http://www.markyboy.net/ibarpt2.jpg

(Taken from pages 50 and 51 of IBA Technical Review 2 1977
Last edited by Markymark on 8 August 2010 9:15am - 2 times in total
WE
Westy2
Going back to 'Special Branch', is this thread's theory about the black & white episodes being produced by ABC rather than Thames got any mileage?

http://www.mausoleumclubforum.org.uk/xmb/viewthread.php?tid=21620

There was a massive change in the middle wasn't there? (Some of the black & white title sequence looked a bit cheap & there appeared to be a 'cheap' title sequence for the first colour episode then it changed again for the next episode, looking like some money had been spent!)

Did ABC possess OBVT cameras for drama, in fact did anyone have the facillity? (I've only seen this early OBVT stuff on post Autumn 69 stuff!)

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