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itsrobert6,366 posts since 23 Mar 2001
Granada North West Today
Thanks deejay for your very informative and enlightening replies. I've always thought contributions by those like yourself and others in the industry are what makes TV Forum so special.

In terms of the PIDLE stings, I can help here. I managed to record one back in 2003:

https://up.metropol247.co.uk/itsrobert/BBC%20World%20News%20-%20Piddle%20In%20Live%20Coverage.rm

In terms of "vamp" I've only ever heard that used in the BBC and, like deejay says, at national level. I've never heard it used at ITN for instance. ITN has always tended to use "bed" and, less commonly, "underscore" and "bubble". The other term I've only ever heard once in relation to the BBC, and specifically regarding the 1993 BBC News re-branding exercise, is "rumble".
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itsrobert6,366 posts since 23 Mar 2001
Granada North West Today
A couple of other ITN terms I'm aware of in case anyone is interested:

Precom - pre commercial sting
Postcom - post commercial sting
Bongs - opening headlines sequence, specifically for ITV News

Not used anymore, but before the News at Ten Big Ben "bongs" became known as such, they were actually referred to as "gongs".
Charles581 posts since 11 Nov 2009
BBC World News

Is the VO, SOT, PKG, NATVO etc. nomenclature used in the UK as well, or do you have different terms?


Yes, though there are differences between broadcasters. I think almost everyone refers to recorded items as VT or Package.

BBC specific terms I can think of are:
OOV (out of vision) (everyone else calls these VOs, underlays, or overlays)
CSO (colour separation overlay) (everyone else calls this chromakey or green screen)

SOT (sound on tape, occasionally SOF) / UPSOT (up sound on tape) is common, though ACT for actuality is also common in the BBC.

VAMP is common in the network newsroom, but in the regions I’ve worked in at the BBC, music running under headlines is known as a bed (which is a radio term I think).

VIS is common in the BBC when the presenter is to be brought back into vision, but I have seen freelancers put NCIV ‘Newscaster in vision’ which causes some confusion the first time it’s seen by BBC lifers!


Interesting, thanks for sharing. "Vamp" generally has a different meaning over here to signify when anchors have no script and ad-lib, usually as they wait for a press conference to begin or for a live reporter/interview to get ready.
dosxuk4,216 posts since 22 Oct 2005
Yorkshire Look North (Yorkshire)

Is the VO, SOT, PKG, NATVO etc. nomenclature used in the UK as well, or do you have different terms?


Yes, though there are differences between broadcasters. I think almost everyone refers to recorded items as VT or Package.

BBC specific terms I can think of are:
OOV (out of vision) (everyone else calls these VOs, underlays, or overlays)
CSO (colour separation overlay) (everyone else calls this chromakey or green screen)

SOT (sound on tape, occasionally SOF) / UPSOT (up sound on tape) is common, though ACT for actuality is also common in the BBC.

VAMP is common in the network newsroom, but in the regions I’ve worked in at the BBC, music running under headlines is known as a bed (which is a radio term I think).

VIS is common in the BBC when the presenter is to be brought back into vision, but I have seen freelancers put NCIV ‘Newscaster in vision’ which causes some confusion the first time it’s seen by BBC lifers!


Interesting, thanks for sharing. "Vamp" generally has a different meaning over here to signify when anchors have no script and ad-lib, usually as they wait for a press conference to begin or for a live reporter/interview to get ready.


I think they're both based on the same origin - a vamp in musical terms is a fill in piece for an unknown amount of time, while other stuff is going on. Common in musical theatre as a direction is "vamp until ready", meaning the orchestra repeat a short piece until the action on stage is ready to continue.
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itsrobert6,366 posts since 23 Mar 2001
Granada North West Today
That makes perfect sense now because beds/underscores in TV News are usually fairly repetitive pieces of music.

Does anyone have any clues as to when the first bed/vamp/underscore was used on British TV News? I've not seen any examples of ones from the 1970s or before. The earliest I can think of off the top of my head is maybe ITN when they slightly refreshed their weekend bulletins in 1982. Prior to that, they had used "Non Stop" but all the examples I have seen indicate it was only used for a few seconds at the start. ITN introduced a synthesised piece of music in the summer of 1982 and this was used as an underscore to the spoken headlines. Can anyone think of anything earlier than that?
JamesWorldNews8,148 posts since 22 Aug 2004
STV Central BBC World News
Thanks for reminding me of just how old I am, Steve! Haha. And interesting (as an aside) to see that report from John Humphrys about “white people versus the red indians”. We live in very changed days now.

Back on topic: I guess this piece of music does qualify as an early example of a bed/underscore/vamp.
@JamesWorldNews | Formerly BBC WORLD
noggin14,546 posts since 26 Jun 2001

Is the VO, SOT, PKG, NATVO etc. nomenclature used in the UK as well, or do you have different terms?


SOT (sound on tape, occasionally SOF) / UPSOT (up sound on tape) is common, though ACT for actuality is also common in the BBC.

SOVT - Sound On/Off VT is also a common phrase. (UPSOT/UPSOF/UPSOVT should be reserved for a run that starts with OOV and then has an UPSOT when the presenter stops talking)
Quote:


VIS is common in the BBC when the presenter is to be brought back into vision, but I have seen freelancers put NCIV ‘Newscaster in vision’ which causes some confusion the first time it’s seen by BBC lifers!

BIV (Back in Vision) is often also used in scripts (along with PRES or the presenter name)
cityprod1,982 posts since 3 Oct 2005
Westcountry Spotlight
That makes perfect sense now because beds/underscores in TV News are usually fairly repetitive pieces of music.

Does anyone have any clues as to when the first bed/vamp/underscore was used on British TV News? I've not seen any examples of ones from the 1970s or before. The earliest I can think of off the top of my head is maybe ITN when they slightly refreshed their weekend bulletins in 1982. Prior to that, they had used "Non Stop" but all the examples I have seen indicate it was only used for a few seconds at the start. ITN introduced a synthesised piece of music in the summer of 1982 and this was used as an underscore to the spoken headlines. Can anyone think of anything earlier than that?


Technically, wouldn't the News At Ten bongs from 1967 onwards count, as they were played with the headlines being voiced over the top of them?

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Night Thoughts240 posts since 24 Jan 2016
London London
That Grampian ident sounds like something you'd hear echoing out of a short wave radio.

*rustles papers*

*rustles papers some more*

I wonder if that British Airways story was late breaking news, or they were just a bit unorganised that night. Certainly sounds dramatic with that pause and the paper shuffling!