The Newsroom

ITV News

Brand realignment onwards (October 2009)

This site closed in March 2021 and is now a read-only archive
JO
Joe
bilky asko posted:
ITNCameraman posted:
Joe posted:
ITNCameraman posted:
Joe posted:
And presumably you're not going to share them.

That's a bit impertinent - a trait that seems to be all too commonplace on this forum. Actually, I was on the road, working on a programme whilst briefly browsing this thread. I thought I'd quickly make the point that there are good reasons for the way we do things. I can list them all if you like (it's mainly to do with camera positions, angles of view and the setups we use for different programmes) but I shouldn't imagine it would make that much sense without being in the studio.

Actually, it feels like many of your posts deliberately hold back information, which can be quite annoying after a while.

I think your post describes excellently why professionals working in television don't seem to post on this forum as much as you might like. I choose Twitter as my main medium for engaging with people interested in television news, and I think you'd be hard-pressed to find anyone who says I don't answer all questions courteously and offer as much information as I can to people who are interested.

Do I withold information that I could reveal? Yes, of course: that's the necessary and responsible thing to do as an employee. I am currently involved with blocking and planning the shots and look for the revamp of ITV News in January. Do I deliberately lord that retention of information on this forum? No, I don't think I do. If that's "annoying" to you, I'm very sorry. It's certainly not intended to be so. I was just trying to be helpful.

I think I'll probably stick to Twitter...


I think he means that it can often seem like you're deliberately holding back information you could tell us - not ITN top secret documents or suchlike. Sometimes you will, say, disagree with a member, and then not follow up with an explanation. Remember that the majority of members here aren't particularly knowledgeable; you sometimes talk to members like they should know something that seems obvious to you, but isn't obvious at all.

I don't know whether your curtness is due to you being used to Twitter - this is a forum, and longer posts filled with what may seem like tiny, irrelevant details excites many members here - just see the Presenters and Rotas threads.

Members here appreciate your posts, but they often need an explanation as to why you can't reveal something, or satiating with boring details.


I don't wish to argue. What Bilky has said is how I feel. I'm sorry if it offends, but it's just how it is.
GS
Gavin Scott Founding member
Joe posted:
bilky asko posted:
ITNCameraman posted:
Joe posted:
ITNCameraman posted:
Joe posted:
And presumably you're not going to share them.

That's a bit impertinent - a trait that seems to be all too commonplace on this forum. Actually, I was on the road, working on a programme whilst briefly browsing this thread. I thought I'd quickly make the point that there are good reasons for the way we do things. I can list them all if you like (it's mainly to do with camera positions, angles of view and the setups we use for different programmes) but I shouldn't imagine it would make that much sense without being in the studio.

Actually, it feels like many of your posts deliberately hold back information, which can be quite annoying after a while.

I think your post describes excellently why professionals working in television don't seem to post on this forum as much as you might like. I choose Twitter as my main medium for engaging with people interested in television news, and I think you'd be hard-pressed to find anyone who says I don't answer all questions courteously and offer as much information as I can to people who are interested.

Do I withold information that I could reveal? Yes, of course: that's the necessary and responsible thing to do as an employee. I am currently involved with blocking and planning the shots and look for the revamp of ITV News in January. Do I deliberately lord that retention of information on this forum? No, I don't think I do. If that's "annoying" to you, I'm very sorry. It's certainly not intended to be so. I was just trying to be helpful.

I think I'll probably stick to Twitter...


I think he means that it can often seem like you're deliberately holding back information you could tell us - not ITN top secret documents or suchlike. Sometimes you will, say, disagree with a member, and then not follow up with an explanation. Remember that the majority of members here aren't particularly knowledgeable; you sometimes talk to members like they should know something that seems obvious to you, but isn't obvious at all.

I don't know whether your curtness is due to you being used to Twitter - this is a forum, and longer posts filled with what may seem like tiny, irrelevant details excites many members here - just see the Presenters and Rotas threads.

Members here appreciate your posts, but they often need an explanation as to why you can't reveal something, or satiating with boring details.


I don't wish to argue. What Bilky has said is how I feel. I'm sorry if it offends, but it's just how it is.


Well, as pointless "feelings" that nobody asked for are the order of the day, you may have a dose of mine.

I genuinely couldn't care less how you or Bilky perceive ITNCameraman's posting style - but I won't sit back while you poison the well for everyone else.

Your demands for more information, follow-up and explanations - phrased in a way that suits YOU - has the member suggest he may go back to Twitter - a site I really can't be bothered to get involved with. I'd much prefer him to stay and offer whatever information and insight he can I whatever way he has the time and inclination to do.

If you read carefully what he has said, it is HIS opinion that this site suffers from impertinent members who don't respect the insider contributions - which is why they're seldom offered.

So why don't you just button it and not spoilt for others?

Am I saying that because you're not in the industry you're some obtuse piece of flotsam?

Maybe that's "just how I feel". Do you begin to see how unpleasant such an unnecessary utterance is now you're on the receiving end?
IT
itsrobert Founding member
Well said, Gavin.

I think some people need a reality check here. Neither Matt nor anyone else working in broadcasting is obligated to provide us with information. You seem to be forgetting that television channels are operated by companies - if you work for any company in any sector you will know that you have to agree to keep company information to yourself. Imagine if Matt spills the beans on how everything is done at ITN only for him to get into trouble when a competitor reads all about it. How would that make you feel? He and others come here through their own choice and reveal snippets here and there - and we should all be grateful for that contribution.

I'd argue that TV Forum would not still have been here after 11 years had it not been for the contributions from insiders to keep the conversation going. You're forgetting that in the days before the internet, we watched presentation on the television and enjoyed it for what it was. We had no way of finding out how it was done or what, if any, changes were in the pipeline. Many now seem to expect to know every little detail about something which they have no involvement in. Let's just be grateful for what we do know instead of driving Matt away.
IT
ITNCameraman
Mike W posted:
In that case, a weird question - what are the most difficult, technically, shots you can do in the current arrangement and why? Is it possible to confuse the VR system by trying to pull a shot off?

It's not really possible to confuse the VR system with a difficult shot, Mike. As long as the tracking camera mounted on the studio camera can 'see' 5 or more ceiling targets, then it will be able to render the correct background in real time. So if you try to go too high on the jib (so the angle of view of the upwards-facing tracking camera becomes less), or you position yourself under a large studio lamp, then you will lose tracking and the background won't track properly. We get to know our useable limits in any given studio.

As for techincally challenging shots, well the jib is a pretty serious bit of kit that requires a fair amount of dexterity, spatial awareness and creative input. Think about a regular studio camera. You have control of pan (left and right), tilt (up and down), zoom (focal length) and focus. In addition you may be tracking the ped in, out, left or right, and rising or falling on the pedestal - all at the same time and maintaining perfect framing and focus.

On a jib, all of the above still applies, but in addition you can swing the jib arm left, right, up and/or down, whereupon you'll have to compensate for this movement on the camera head. Which is 15 feet away from you. And all this in a VR environment, where the set isn't really there!

All this means that even the most basic live jib shots need a pretty precise input, fine motor control and hours of practice! Generally speakng, though, wide and fast shots are reasonably straightforward. Slow drifts on the tight end of a lens that then reveal a graphic at a very precise point in the studio, at a very precise time in the script, are a little more challenging. It's not the sort of work that most jib operators do, but we like the challenge!

Hope that's helpful.
MW
Mike W
Matt, that post was exactly the sort of response I'd hoped for, thanks so much for taking the time to write that! I'd never really considered the use of a jib to be hard so that's me told! Doesn't stop me wanting one for Christmas though!

I wish we had a +1/thanks system on here
JW
JamesWorldNews
Spatial awareness is one of those things that people in aviation can relate to. So, for once in my life, I actually understood what you meant there, Matt.

Doors to manual.
NI
Nicky
ITNCameraman posted:
No problem - I didn't mean you, Nicky. Opinion on shots is always welcome and a subject close to my heart! Wink


It was really your camera work on NAT 2008-09 that got me interested in how cameras work within the virtual environment. I remember using 3ds Max a good few years ago to recreate the ITV News studio, and trying as hard as I could to replicate your opening shot! See the second video on this page: http://www.tvforum.co.uk/thegallery/itv-news-studio-mock-recreation-updated-29480

One particularly nice jib shot I recall from the NAT 08 era was one that was used quite often for the closing sequence. The camera slowly panned away from the desk (at ground level), and then rose high up into the air when the famous "da da-da da" motif kicked in at the end of the theme tune, showing the skyline in all its glory. Was that your shot Matt? Loved that one.

I can't find any videos on YouTube of this particular shot (it wasn't on the first night), but I think I might have one example recorded on DVD somewhere. Must dig it out soon!
BA
bilky asko
Gavin Scott posted:

Well, as pointless "feelings" that nobody asked for are the order of the day, you may have a dose of mine.

I genuinely couldn't care less how you or Bilky perceive ITNCameraman's posting style - but I won't sit back while you poison the well for everyone else.

Your demands for more information, follow-up and explanations - phrased in a way that suits YOU - has the member suggest he may go back to Twitter - a site I really can't be bothered to get involved with. I'd much prefer him to stay and offer whatever information and insight he can I whatever way he has the time and inclination to do.

If you read carefully what he has said, it is HIS opinion that this site suffers from impertinent members who don't respect the insider contributions - which is why they're seldom offered.

So why don't you just button it and not spoilt for others?

Am I saying that because you're not in the industry you're some obtuse piece of flotsam?

Maybe that's "just how I feel". Do you begin to see how unpleasant such an unnecessary utterance is now you're on the receiving end?

I would like to say that I felt the need to explain his point of view to a member who, despite his insider knowledge, is on the obtuse side of politeness. I don't think that any member here has the right to be rude, no matter how "important" they are to you or others.

My observations of his style and explanation as to why some members get frustrated is hardly a personal attack on him. You telling him and me to shut up is rather rude.
BR
Brekkie
Gavin Scott posted:
Well, as pointless "feelings" that nobody asked for are the order of the day, you may have a dose of mine.

I genuinely couldn't care less how you or Bilky perceive ITNCameraman's posting style - but I won't sit back while you poison the well for everyone else.

Your demands for more information, follow-up and explanations - phrased in a way that suits YOU - has the member suggest he may go back to Twitter - a site I really can't be bothered to get involved with. I'd much prefer him to stay and offer whatever information and insight he can I whatever way he has the time and inclination to do.

If you read carefully what he has said, it is HIS opinion that this site suffers from impertinent members who don't respect the insider contributions - which is why they're seldom offered.

So why don't you just button it and not spoilt for others?

Am I saying that because you're not in the industry you're some obtuse piece of flotsam?

Maybe that's "just how I feel". Do you begin to see how unpleasant such an unnecessary utterance is now you're on the receiving end?

Well said - and I think out of respect for the other members who don't want to read pages of lengthy posts debating what other people should be posting it's surely time to get back on topic, which I'll do with a bit of Julie Etchingham love. The papers may spend months speculating who is on the X Factor panel or sports hosts changing channels etc. but for me signing Julie back in 2008 is probably the best move ITV have made this century - and a move that's worked for both of them. I do think she has that rare quality of being both authoritive and accessible to viewers - many newsreaders struggle to be both IMO.
BA
bilky asko
Brekkie posted:
Gavin Scott posted:
Well, as pointless "feelings" that nobody asked for are the order of the day, you may have a dose of mine.

I genuinely couldn't care less how you or Bilky perceive ITNCameraman's posting style - but I won't sit back while you poison the well for everyone else.

Your demands for more information, follow-up and explanations - phrased in a way that suits YOU - has the member suggest he may go back to Twitter - a site I really can't be bothered to get involved with. I'd much prefer him to stay and offer whatever information and insight he can I whatever way he has the time and inclination to do.

If you read carefully what he has said, it is HIS opinion that this site suffers from impertinent members who don't respect the insider contributions - which is why they're seldom offered.

So why don't you just button it and not spoilt for others?

Am I saying that because you're not in the industry you're some obtuse piece of flotsam?

Maybe that's "just how I feel". Do you begin to see how unpleasant such an unnecessary utterance is now you're on the receiving end?

Well said - and I think out of respect for the other members who don't want to read pages of lengthy posts debating what other people should be posting it's surely time to get back on topic, which I'll do with a bit of Julie Etchingham love. The papers may spend months speculating who is on the X Factor panel or sports hosts changing channels etc. but for me signing Julie back in 2008 is probably the best move ITV have made this century - and a move that's worked for both of them. I do think she has that rare quality of being both authoritive and accessible to viewers - many newsreaders struggle to be both IMO.

Ahem...
AN
Ant
Ignore 'em. I think the majority of members on here are grateful to you (and others) for your contributions.
RB
RobB
Brekkie posted:
Gavin Scott posted:
Well, as pointless "feelings" that nobody asked for are the order of the day, you may have a dose of mine.

I genuinely couldn't care less how you or Bilky perceive ITNCameraman's posting style - but I won't sit back while you poison the well for everyone else.

Your demands for more information, follow-up and explanations - phrased in a way that suits YOU - has the member suggest he may go back to Twitter - a site I really can't be bothered to get involved with. I'd much prefer him to stay and offer whatever information and insight he can I whatever way he has the time and inclination to do.

If you read carefully what he has said, it is HIS opinion that this site suffers from impertinent members who don't respect the insider contributions - which is why they're seldom offered.

So why don't you just button it and not spoilt for others?

Am I saying that because you're not in the industry you're some obtuse piece of flotsam?

Maybe that's "just how I feel". Do you begin to see how unpleasant such an unnecessary utterance is now you're on the receiving end?

Well said - and I think out of respect for the other members who don't want to read pages of lengthy posts debating what other people should be posting it's surely time to get back on topic, which I'll do with a bit of Julie Etchingham love. The papers may spend months speculating who is on the X Factor panel or sports hosts changing channels etc. but for me signing Julie back in 2008 is probably the best move ITV have made this century - and a move that's worked for both of them. I do think she has that rare quality of being both authoritive and accessible to viewers - many newsreaders struggle to be both IMO.


I think Julie has to be one of the best newscasters on TV at the moment. I'd like to see her made the senior Anchor on ITV News. No disrespect to Mark, but I think she has much more of a commanding presence than he does.

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