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62305823,467 posts since 19 Aug 2005
We've had three threads, and still never got to the bottom of certain questions:

Did we ever found out when:

* ITN weekend news got given its new look in December 1987?
* When News at ten got its new look in 1985 ( between May - Sept)
* When News at ten got its new look in 1988 ( by May )

1995 look dates: from itsrobert posted:
Quote:

* Lunchtime News: 13th March 1995
* Early Evening News: 5th June 1995
* Morning News: 18th June 1995
* Weekend: 15th July 1995


Here is Fiona doing the News at ten: https://youtu.be/eWKgDjLvNKA?t=203

lets not forget sue again: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fjCFSMHrYj0&ab_channel=tv68


Of course the two older threads:
* https://tvforum.uk/thenewsroom/itn-classic-presentation-41383/
* https://tvforum.uk/thenewsroom/vintage-itn-news-presentation-41740/
cityprod1,967 posts since 3 Oct 2005
Westcountry Spotlight
Did we ever found out when:

* ITN weekend news got given its new look in December 1987?


As best as I can tell so far, it was either 5th December or 12th December.

This video from 29th Nov 1987 shows the old look.


But this one from the 12th December 1987 shows the new look.
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JamesWorldNews8,002 posts since 22 Aug 2004
STV Central BBC World News
Ahhh. Good old ITN.

Whilst liking all of the above, I have to admit that I truly like the current theme music package used on ITV News.

I wad never a fan at all of the atrium era music.

And the classic News at Ten package is timeless and would still fit today.
@JamesWorldNews | Formerly BBC WORLD
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bluecortina850 posts since 26 Jul 2012
Did we ever found out when:

* ITN weekend news got given its new look in December 1987?


As best as I can tell so far, it was either 5th December or 12th December.

This video from 29th Nov 1987 shows the old look.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8nZcjQEFw5Y

But this one from the 12th December 1987 shows the new look.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rSWwM-Qhclc


I note HTV manage to perform a non-timed wipe to the HTV slide at the end of the film, and LWT manage to perform a non-sync cut to ITN. No excuse for either really. Funny what you notice when you're sitting having your first cuppa of the day!
Markymark6,962 posts since 13 Dec 2004
Meridian (North) South Today
Did we ever found out when:

* ITN weekend news got given its new look in December 1987?


As best as I can tell so far, it was either 5th December or 12th December.

This video from 29th Nov 1987 shows the old look.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8nZcjQEFw5Y

But this one from the 12th December 1987 shows the new look.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rSWwM-Qhclc


I note HTV manage to perform a non-timed wipe to the HTV slide at the end of the film, and LWT manage to perform a non-sync cut to ITN. No excuse for either really. Funny what you notice when you're sitting having your first cuppa of the day!


Yes, interesting, and both late 80s so we were well into the frame store synchroniser era. The HTV one looks to be an sc/h phase error ?
noggin14,442 posts since 26 Jun 2001
Synchronisers still didn't have the best reputations in the 80s did they though - as they knocked the edges off the pictures quite badly in some cases - so I can understand the LWT non-sync cut.
Markymark6,962 posts since 13 Dec 2004
Meridian (North) South Today
Synchronisers still didn't have the best reputations in the 80s did they though - as they knocked the edges off the pictures quite badly in some cases - so I can understand the LWT non-sync cut.


Yes. I remember TVS were using them 1983ish, I complained to the IBA about the impairment they were introducing. Funnily enough a year later I ended up working for a company where my boss was the bloke
that had been called into TVS to sort out his frame syncs because of the impairments. (You could see a faint 'grid' of 'blacker than black' dots )
noggin14,442 posts since 26 Jun 2001
Synchronisers still didn't have the best reputations in the 80s did they though - as they knocked the edges off the pictures quite badly in some cases - so I can understand the LWT non-sync cut.


Yes. I remember TVS were using them 1983ish, I complained to the IBA about the impairment they were introducing. Funnily enough a year later I ended up working for a company where my boss was the bloke
that had been called into TVS to sort out his frame syncs because of the impairments. (You could see a faint 'grid' of 'blacker than black' dots )


They had a dreadful reputation in the early days at the BBC. They were deemed useful for synchronising radio cameras etc. - but not seen as a great way of permanently handling incoming circuits to Pres.

ISTR being told that the cleanest pictures you'd ever see on Net 1 were Wimbledon off-air from Crystal Palace before a synchroniser was in the way. (The LDK5s used by BBC OBs delivered far better quality pictures than the Links at TVC - and the EMIs if we're being honest...)
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bluecortina850 posts since 26 Jul 2012

As best as I can tell so far, it was either 5th December or 12th December.

This video from 29th Nov 1987 shows the old look.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8nZcjQEFw5Y

But this one from the 12th December 1987 shows the new look.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rSWwM-Qhclc


I note HTV manage to perform a non-timed wipe to the HTV slide at the end of the film, and LWT manage to perform a non-sync cut to ITN. No excuse for either really. Funny what you notice when you're sitting having your first cuppa of the day!


Yes, interesting, and both late 80s so we were well into the frame store synchroniser era. The HTV one looks to be an sc/h phase error ?


Looks as though the chaps at HTV have correctly timed the source subcarrier-wise, but not quite sync-wise. Some mixers would warn you of that - helpful!

I only hesitate to use the expression sc/h phase error because as you know we tended to think of that in terms of the 8 field subcarrier/sync timing on a day to day basis rather than source timings. Not really important on a presentation mixer, and when you think about it not really important on a studio mixer provided you had a proc-amp on the output of it as you would set the sc/H phase there and it would not alter no matter what sources you 'cut up'.
Last edited by bluecortina on 3 February 2018 7:15pm
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bluecortina850 posts since 26 Jul 2012
Synchronisers still didn't have the best reputations in the 80s did they though - as they knocked the edges off the pictures quite badly in some cases - so I can understand the LWT non-sync cut.


LWT used a couple of syncs. Questech something or others and Quantel DFS 1751's. The ITN would have had a local Quantel in circuit given the era.

Someone was out in the Europe somewhere covering football match with a 1751 which was pretty reliable apart from one of the input (or output) locking loops that used a particular diode that would fail due to heat eventually. When this chap went abroad with one he took a diode with him.

Out at the broadcast centre there were some Swiss chaps looking glumly at a 1751 synchroniser that was not working - unlocked pictures. The chap casually produced the diode from his trouser pocket, gave it to the Swiss chaps and said - you need one of these. The Swiss chaps changed the diode and of course it cured the fault. Great engineer, I would have loved to have been there!
bluecortina850 posts since 26 Jul 2012
Synchronisers still didn't have the best reputations in the 80s did they though - as they knocked the edges off the pictures quite badly in some cases - so I can understand the LWT non-sync cut.


Yes. I remember TVS were using them 1983ish, I complained to the IBA about the impairment they were introducing. Funnily enough a year later I ended up working for a company where my boss was the bloke
that had been called into TVS to sort out his frame syncs because of the impairments. (You could see a faint 'grid' of 'blacker than black' dots )


I wonder who complained first - you or me! I used to regularly complain about TVS' synchroniser performances as I had an indirect route back in the day.
1
Markymark gave kudos
bluecortina850 posts since 26 Jul 2012
Synchronisers still didn't have the best reputations in the 80s did they though - as they knocked the edges off the pictures quite badly in some cases - so I can understand the LWT non-sync cut.


Yes. I remember TVS were using them 1983ish, I complained to the IBA about the impairment they were introducing. Funnily enough a year later I ended up working for a company where my boss was the bloke
that had been called into TVS to sort out his frame syncs because of the impairments. (You could see a faint 'grid' of 'blacker than black' dots )


They had a dreadful reputation in the early days at the BBC. They were deemed useful for synchronising radio cameras etc. - but not seen as a great way of permanently handling incoming circuits to Pres.

ISTR being told that the cleanest pictures you'd ever see on Net 1 were Wimbledon off-air from Crystal Palace before a synchroniser was in the way. (The LDK5s used by BBC OBs delivered far better quality pictures than the Links at TVC - and the EMIs if we're being honest...)


Not a camera I ever worked on, But I have to say those Philips cameras always seemed to produce 'lovely' pictures to my eye.