Couldn't agree more with SomeRandomStuff. I can't understand why everyone keeps insisting that Gill Sans was "unworkable". It's looked fine to me for the last four years, and its cousin Johnston looks excellent on even quite wordy TfL signage. Lambie Nairn, who are paid to know about broadcast design, have selected it twice for use on BBC News graphics, and an in-house BBC design team have twice decided to ditch it. I'm open to hearing it explained, of course, but to my eyes the use of Helvetica/Swiss/whatever looks crap.
At the very least, the programme slugs should use the same font as that on their respective titles, which is, in most cases, Gill Sans.
Gill worked perfectly well in the last set of graphics... I just cant understand the logic behind changing it.
They've been flitting back and forth between the two since launch, haven't they?
The problem that was created when Gill Sans was chosen as the font is that, being a well known font, it goes in and out of style.
Bollócks. It's been around for nearly a century, and was chosen as a corporate font for the BBC in 1997 precisely because of its longevity and timelessness. Basically the opposite of what you've said.
The reason for the flitting is that BBC News decided to ditch it (for graphics) in 2003. Lambie Nairn reinstated it in 2008, and now BBC News has ditched it again.
I know about the provenance of Gill Sans. However, it does have phases of coming into fashion and going out of fashion. The same happens with Helvetica. I don't understand how it existing for decades negates what I said (considering I said it knowing full well how long it had been around).
One problem with Gill Sans is that some of its weights are ugly - having a range of good weights is essential for a news channel. Another problem is that some of the characters are too wide. A third problem is the capital J that extends below the baseline, which makes ticker design a problem. Gill Sans is not a perfect font, and it's fine to disagree with Lambie Nairn on its usage.
I know about the provenance of Gill Sans. However, it does have phases of coming into fashion and going out of fashion. The same happens with Helvetica. I don't understand how it existing for decades negates what I said (considering I said it knowing full well how long it had been around).
One problem with Gill Sans is that some of its weights are ugly - having a range of good weights is essential for a news channel. Another problem is that some of the characters are too wide. A third problem is the capital J that extends below the baseline, which makes ticker design a problem. Gill Sans is not a perfect font, and it's fine to disagree with Lambie Nairn on its usage.
Of course it is, and apologies for being a bit over the top. Evidently, you know more about this than I do. I don't claim that Gill Sans is a perfect font, but personally, I think it looked better on screen, despite the issues that you've mentioned.
Even if what you say is true, I disagree that its going in and out of fashion (which in any case is only relevant to graphic designers) is of any relevance to its use on news straps. I think its being got rid of is more likely to have been because of the problems you've described above. Whoever it is that's decided (twice) to ditch Gill Sans was evidently not involved in dealing with Lambie Nairn in 2008. Which is a shame, as perhaps together they might have come up with something a little more satisfactory than what they have now.
I think some important technical issues with the font have been raised and, whilst ai think Gill is a brilliant font when it comes to logos and short pieces of text, I think it just doesn't go well in full body text.
By the way this thread has gone, you would think Swiss, and Gill where the only options. Something like Avenir fits well with the use of Gill for logos and branding, as well as being technically well designed for use beyond display uses
By the way this thread has gone, you would think Swiss, and Gill where the only options. Something like Avenir fits well with the use of Gill for logos and branding, as well as being technically well designed for use beyond display uses
Yes, there are plenty of overused fonts to choose from. They could plump for Univers, or Akzidenz-Grotesk, or Gotham. Everyone has their favourite from that list. As I mentioned before, I think it could be advantageous in the long run for them to have a font made for them - whether it's something completely new, or something that blends in well with Gill Sans.
By the way this thread has gone, you would think Swiss, and Gill where the only options. Something like Avenir fits well with the use of Gill for logos and branding, as well as being technically well designed for use beyond display uses
Yes, there are plenty of overused fonts to choose from. They could plump for Univers, or Akzidenz-Grotesk, or Gotham. Everyone has their favourite from that list. As I mentioned before, I think it could be advantageous in the long run for them to have a font made for them - whether it's something completely new, or something that blends in well with Gill Sans.
Arial and Courier New. The latter 'technically' being a script writing font. They could always try Windings and we have to guess what the writing says.
By the way this thread has gone, you would think Swiss, and Gill where the only options. Something like Avenir fits well with the use of Gill for logos and branding, as well as being technically well designed for use beyond display uses
Yes, there are plenty of overused fonts to choose from. They could plump for Univers, or Akzidenz-Grotesk, or Gotham. Everyone has their favourite from that list. As I mentioned before, I think it could be advantageous in the long run for them to have a font made for them - whether it's something completely new, or something that blends in well with Gill Sans.
Arial and Courier New. The latter 'technically' being a script writing font. They could always try Windings and we have to guess what the writing says.
Windings would mess up Tumble's coding system though.....
I was nosing around my routine graphic and design sites, and in perusing the work of production company The Mill, I was shocked to see that the 2013 BBC World Countdown was not created in-house, but by The Mill:
The latter 'technically' being a script writing font. They could always try Windings and we have to guess what the writing says.
