Plymouth’s update was long in the planning involving a virgin site too. The Refurb of the existing site was very much second choice and the issues involved extended the planning process further not withstanding the problems involved in actually doing the work. I suspect the equipment installed is the same planned in the 2000’s for Sutton Harbour.
I suspect the equipment installed is the same planned in the 2000’s for Sutton Harbour.
No, the BBC bought one production system (made by Quantel?) for each region in the early 2000s. Plymouth definately used theirs although I think they were the last because of the aborted plans to relocate.
What they got a few years ago when they had a big refurb had systems in use in BH like Mosart and of course it was HD. It certainly wasn't sitting around for 10 years and they hadn't been using a tape based workflow from the 90s
I suspect the equipment installed is the same planned in the 2000’s for Sutton Harbour.
No, the BBC bought one production system (made by Quantel?) for each region in the early 2000s. Plymouth definately used theirs although I think they were the last because of the aborted plans to relocate.
What they got a few years ago when they had a big refurb had systems in use in BH like Mosart and of course it was HD. It certainly wasn't sitting around for 10 years and they hadn't been using a tape based workflow from the 90s
I
think
Southampton was the last region to switch to Quantel and that was in something like 2006/7. They were, until then, still shooting and editing on tape (in 2- and 3-machine edit suites) and transmitting from a manually operated Profile server or, if the edit was really late, direct from tape.
Then the standard installation for English regions (Project England) was Quantel editing and server, IBIS serverload and serverplay (initially Quantel Janice for playout, but I think that was only fitted in Norwich?). That template was supposed to have been used everywhere and was supposed to have consolidated knowledge, kit and working practices across all sites. However, as the years have rolled on, it’s all drifted again.
Salford, being also used for breakfast, got the full HD Mosart/Viz shebang, as did Plymouth as part of an experiment to see how well it fitted into English regions. Oxford got Jupiter, but not Mosart/Viz. Nottingham have a unique (for the BBC) self op automated gallery which is used for breakfast, but has not been hugely reliable as I understand it. Bristol, Birmingham and Southampton have had new vision mixers owing to the original GVG Zodiak desks reaching end of life. Oxford took some gallery kit from BBC Manchester after NW moved to Salford and replaced their original GVG Pres mixer.
So yes, long overdue and the BBC recognise that the ER kit and working practices have again drifted away from a template kit list for each site. Various options are being looked at, and I’ve no doubt it will be a remote model akin to ViLoR which may be adopted, with some level of automation.
I think Tunbridge Wells might have been the last, but that was replacing the Omnibus system they launched with in 2001.
The other region that got that was London, who never got Quantel but instead cobbled together something Mac based for a bit and then ended up sharing the systems used by the other studios at BH
Last edited by Inspector Sands on 19 August 2019 7:15pm
I
think
Southampton was the last region to switch to Quantel and that was in something like 2006/7. They were, until then, still shooting and editing on tape (in 2- and 3-machine edit suites) and transmitting from a manually operated Profile server or, if the edit was really late, direct from tape.
BBC Northern Ireland were still playing out and editing to tape until 2008 - so it seems one of the nations were last to move.
I can't remember where I heard it, and someone might be able to confirm, but I think the system from Ross, Overdrive, is likely to make its way into the regions over to Mosart?
Even Caspar CG's developers are getting in on the automation business with Sofie.
Plymouth's setup is only about 3-4 years old isn't it? Apparently one reason they won't do the same elsewhere is that they used a lot of the same systems that BH's studios have, so it's rather over specced for a regional studio.
Yep - but based on decisions taken for NBH c. 2012ish and a lot has changed since then
I
think
Southampton was the last region to switch to Quantel and that was in something like 2006/7. They were, until then, still shooting and editing on tape (in 2- and 3-machine edit suites) and transmitting from a manually operated Profile server or, if the edit was really late, direct from tape.
BBC Northern Ireland were still playing out and editing to tape until 2008 - so it seems one of the nations were last to move.
I can't remember where I heard it, and someone might be able to confirm, but I think the system from Ross, Overdrive, is likely to make its way into the regions over to Mosart?
Even Caspar CG's developers are getting in on the automation business with Sofie.
Didn’t Ross get a big contract with Sky? Ross is used widely amongst almost all the TV stations that are owned by the networks here in the US. It was a key backbone in the new Comcast Technology Center going IP.
Ross afaik doesn’t require a physical switcher or panel like Viz Mozart does. I think they are experimenting with including their low spec switcher in the Overdrive box like Viz Opus. Plus they’re makers of CGs, playout servers, Furios and Cambots - pretty much everything needed to run a station.
I can't remember where I heard it, and someone might be able to confirm, but I think the system from Ross, Overdrive, is likely to make its way into the regions over to Mosart?
There's an evaluation mock up/test bed at a secret site (it's not at any live existing regional centre). Full of NDAs, but I'm sure if you ask the right questions on the right stands at IBC next month..........
I
think
Southampton was the last region to switch to Quantel and that was in something like 2006/7. They were, until then, still shooting and editing on tape (in 2- and 3-machine edit suites) and transmitting from a manually operated Profile server or, if the edit was really late, direct from tape.
BBC Northern Ireland were still playing out and editing to tape until 2008 - so it seems one of the nations were last to move.
I can't remember where I heard it, and someone might be able to confirm, but I think the system from Ross, Overdrive, is likely to make its way into the regions over to Mosart?
Even Caspar CG's developers are getting in on the automation business with Sofie.
Didn’t Ross get a big contract with Sky? Ross is used widely amongst almost all the TV stations that are owned by the networks here in the US. It was a key backbone in the new Comcast Technology Center going IP.
Ross afaik doesn’t require a physical switcher or panel like Viz Mozart does.
Eh? There's no requirement for Mosart (no z) to have a physical switcher panel. Lots of Mosart installs are in control rooms without mixer tops (TV2 in Copenhagen is a good example) . What makes you think you need a switcher control surface?
Yes - Mosart requires vision mixer functionality outside the Mosart product, just as I believe Ross Overdrive does, (the core Overdrive automation software doesn't include HD-SDI or 2110/2022-6/7 IP connectivity or processing.) but as long as this external VM functionality can be controlled via industry standard protocols then however the functionality is implemented (separate hardware + control surface, separate hardware and no control surface, commodity IT gear switching in the IP domain etc.) Mosart can control it (just as any automation system could)
Of course you can 'hide' switcher hardware inside a PC, and pretend it's part of the same product, but essentially when Ross do this they are integrating two products into one box.
Lots of Mosart installs do integrate traditional switchers, mainly because the non-traditional ones still don't scale big enough to offer the same functionality required for the 'big studio' shows that Mosart is automating, plus some installs use control surfaces as they need to run in both full-automation and semi-automated (or non-automated) modes - where a switcher panel is required for full control. For quick set-up and programming having one control surface in your installation (which can be routed to multiple engines) can be much easier than trying to program new effects, macros etc. via the software control panels that most switcher manufacturers offer (which are used to allow offline effects/macro programming and set-up offline or online etc.)
Quote:
I think they are experimenting with including their low spec switcher in the Overdrive box like Viz Opus. Plus they’re makers of CGs, playout servers, Furios and Cambots - pretty much everything needed to run a station.
Yep - I believe Ross Graphite (a vision mixer on a PCI-e card), Ross Expression (a CG on a PCI-e card) and Ross Overdrive can effectively run within a PC or PCs, with the Graphite having a bunch of HD-SDI I/O ports, and the Expression GFX feeds connecting to the Graphite card internally. As all the English regions have just had Quantel - sorry SAM, sorry GVG - server upgrades to new HD-ready servers, I suspect they will be integrated into any future playout system,
Sky News is running on Ross Overdrive (albeit with external vision and sound mixer kit) and OpenMedia I believe, so that ticks the 'OpenMedia integration' box for the BBC without them having to re-invent the wheel.
However other large operations are now implementing off-site all-IP production environments where a small number of very big hardware switchers (think Kahuna 9600s) are sited in a data centre, with remote production control rooms (possibly in different countries) taking control of all, or just part (one or two MEs) of those Kahunas for production purposes. You could do that with a Maverik or Kula control panel at the remote control room, or just have a Mosart (or similar) automation control platform operated from that remote control room. That moves away from 'switcher per control room' concepts entirely, you just map the facilities you need from a larger crate.
You could easily see one future for BBC English regions where two data centres housed a bunch of Kahuna crates (not one per region, but possibly one shared between two or three?), Quantel servers, Mosart control engines, audio processing cores, talkback matrices etc. with cameras fed down to that centre in the 2110/2022-7 domain (possibly lightly compressed - but probably not needed to be) and some reverse visions carrying multi-viewers, in-vision screen feeds, PGM and PST, and audio and comms streams for local monitoring and panels.
Just as easily you could see a future where a Ross Graphite+Expression+Overdrive, or BlackMagic Constellation + NRK Sofie system could be installed in each region. The latter is probably cheaper, but the former may pay dividends in the long term, particularly in launching new services, relocating production centres etc. (ViLOR has made relocation of radio stations MUCH quicker)
Last edited by noggin on 20 August 2019 9:35am - 4 times in total
BBC Northern Ireland were still playing out and editing to tape until 2008 - so it seems one of the nations were last to move.
I can't remember where I heard it, and someone might be able to confirm, but I think the system from Ross, Overdrive, is likely to make its way into the regions over to Mosart?
Even Caspar CG's developers are getting in on the automation business with Sofie.
Didn’t Ross get a big contract with Sky? Ross is used widely amongst almost all the TV stations that are owned by the networks here in the US. It was a key backbone in the new Comcast Technology Center going IP.
Ross afaik doesn’t require a physical switcher or panel like Viz Mozart does.
Eh? There's no requirement for Mosart (no z) to have a physical switcher panel. Lots of Mosart installs are in control rooms without mixer tops (TV2 in Copenhagen is a good example) . What makes you think you need a switcher control surface?
Yes - Mosart requires vision mixer functionality outside the Mosart product, just as I believe Ross Overdrive does, (the core Overdrive automation software doesn't include HD-SDI or 2110/2022-6/7 IP connectivity or processing.) but as long as this external VM functionality can be controlled via industry standard protocols then however the functionality is implemented (separate hardware + control surface, separate hardware and no control surface, commodity IT gear switching in the IP domain etc.) Mosart can control it (just as any automation system could)
Of course you can 'hide' switcher hardware inside a PC, and pretend it's part of the same product, but essentially when Ross do this they are integrating two products into one box.
Quote:
I think they are experimenting with including their low spec switcher in the Overdrive box like Viz Opus. Plus they’re makers of CGs, playout servers, Furios and Cambots - pretty much everything needed to run a station.
Yep - I believe Ross Graphite (a vision mixer on a PCI-e card), Ross Expression (a CG on a PCI-e card) and Ross Overdrive can effectively run within a PC or PCs, with the Graphite having a bunch of HD-SDI I/O ports, and the Expression GFX feeds connecting to the Graphite card internally. As all the English regions have just had Quantel - sorry SAM, sorry GVG - server upgrades to new HD-ready servers, I suspect they will be integrated into any future playout system,
Sky News is running on Ross Overdrive (albeit with external vision and sound mixer kit) and OpenMedia I believe, so that ticks the 'OpenMedia integration' box for the BBC without them having to re-invent the wheel.
When is this fancy equipment coming to Leeds then? It seems we are 20 years behind the south and Salford.