A look back at the archives was shown tonight, fittingly presented by Stuart Hall and there'll be another feature about the archives on NWT tomorrow evening. There is also an interesting history section on the website, including a look back at the previous titles and formats.
I just wrote in the Media Websites section that this whole part of the NWT website is great. There's a picture of Dave Guest from 1993 which is brilliant.
[quote Is Derbyshire in the North West? I thought it was part of the Midlands.
Its stupid how places like that are in BBC North West territory when places in the North West like (most of) Cumbria are not.[/quote]
There a parts of North Derbyshire that get their transmitter pictures from the North West (Basically Buxton, Glossop and nearby places) and they are the areas that North West Tonight would cover.
Its mostly a factor of geography, i.e. what is the nearest main transmitter the "relay" transmitter in a particular area can see. The terrain of the Cumbrian hills and mountains, for instance, has quite an effect on that.
There are other factors, the Isle of Man for instance has, through the ports of the North West, strong historical ties, but actually it is closer to the transmitters of North Cumbria which carry the BBC's programme from Newcastle. However most of the transmitters on the Isle of Man are switched during opt-out time to North West Tonight (they aren't switched normally as the path the pictures take gives a slightly inferior quality.)
I think BBC North West seems to be the main region for the Isle Of Man now, on the NW versions of Ceefax and BBCi you get a 'News from the Isle Of Man' page, and it does get featured on North West Tonight from time to time. I did recall they did an IoM feature a couple of years ago where they sent Dianne and the crew out to do some features and they did a good job of it too.
I think part of the problem is that UK geography has become so confused by changing administrative areas. "Cumbria" was created in 1974 solely for administrative purposes. It covers 4 historic counties - part of Yorkshire, Cumberland, Westmorland and North Lancashire. Isn't that why parts of the area are included in NWT? Barrow, all the way up to Lake Coniston is part of Lancashire, just no longer the council area of the same name, so makes sense to be covered along with the rest of the county, and separate to Cumberland which is closer in identity and geography to Northumberland. As for Derbyshire, when they created Greater Manchester, I think some bits of Cheshire became detatched from Cheshire County Council and so were put under the administration of Derbyshire CC. I think this must partly account for the apparently odd boundaries.
It really annoys me that the BBC insist on referring to administrative areas as geographical areas when they change so often! People from Blackburn are no longer announced on NWT as being from Lancashire just because the councils have changed. The historic county has never been abolished!
I think part of the problem is that UK geography has become so confused by changing administrative areas. "Cumbria" was created in 1974 solely for administrative purposes. It covers 4 historic counties - part of Yorkshire, Cumberland, Westmorland and North Lancashire. Isn't that why parts of the area are included in NWT? Barrow, all the way up to Lake Coniston is part of Lancashire, just no longer the council area of the same name, so makes sense to be covered along with the rest of the county, and separate to Cumberland which is closer in identity and geography to Northumberland. As for Derbyshire, when they created Greater Manchester, I think some bits of Cheshire became detatched from Cheshire County Council and so were put under the administration of Derbyshire CC. I think this must partly account for the apparently odd boundaries.
It really annoys me that the BBC insist on referring to administrative areas as geographical areas when they change so often! People from Blackburn are no longer announced on NWT as being from Lancashire just because the councils have changed. The historic county has never been abolished!
Blackburn and Darwen is still part of Lancashire geographically and ceremonially (as is Blackpool for that matter). The B&D unitary authority is not a county in is own right, so therefore is still in Lancashire.
All that's happened is that the administrative district of Blackburn With Darwen has become independent from Lancashire County Council control. That said, it still shares some of its services with its parent county (fire and police services for instances).
Unitary authorities started to come into force in 1996, but only five of them are actually counties in their own right (the rest 'belong' to a county geograpically). Therefore a discrepancy was created between county council areas and the geographical counties.
A small of Cheshire has ended up in Derbyshire. When Greater Manchester was drawn up, it left a very small part of Ches cut off. I believe this area was called the Tintwistle Rural District, and covered the northern half of Longdendale-- the southern half being covered by Derbyshire. So it was deemed logical that this cut-off bit of Cheshire be absorbed into Derbyshire.
The term Cumbria has been around a long time before the county was realised in 1974. The Cumbrian Mountains have been so named since time immemorial, and I have a Shell Guide to Britain from the 1950s that refers to Cumberland and Westmorland collectively as "Cumbria". I have found that people from the two historic counties have a strong identity with each other, probably why Cumbria hasn't been dropped like Humberside or Avon.
So it was perhaps inevitable and logical to create Cumbria as a proper geographical/ceremonial county. As you say it was created for administration, since Westmorland and Cumberland are sparsely populated; I imagine the powers-that-be thought it would be more efficient to have one county council to run the area.
As for Buxton and Glossop, they have always been in Derbyshire ! The reason they pick up Winter Hill is topographics. Buxton/Glossop lies to the west of the Pennines so the signals from Waltham* or Emley Moor are blocked. However there are no hills between the western edge of High Peak and Winter Hill to block the signal (bearing in mind Greater Manchester lies in a relatively low-lying plane).
*There is a relay transmitter for Waltham at Stanton-on-the-Peak (south-east of Buxton), but I presume that the direct signal from WH would be stronger than a relay station?
The regions issue all seems a bit false really. Is Cheshire really part of the North West - particularly South Cheshire? I would say places like Crewe, Nantwich and even Chester are more part of the Midlands than the North.
Stoke-on-Trent is in Staffordshire and because of this it is included in Midlands Today, yet it is slightly further north than the very far reaches of South Cheshire which are included in NWT. I'm sure much of South Cheshire gets a better reception from the West Midlands transmitter.
The regions issue all seems a bit false really. Is Cheshire really part of the North West - particularly South Cheshire? I would say places like Crewe, Nantwich and even Chester are more part of the Midlands than the North.
Stoke-on-Trent is in Staffordshire and because of this it is included in Midlands Today, yet it is slightly further north than the very far reaches of South Cheshire which are included in NWT. I'm sure much of South Cheshire gets a better reception from the West Midlands transmitter.
South Cheshire and north Staffs are an interesting case. But for inf, south Cheshire's view of the Winter Hill transmitter is almost always very good. In places like Congleton where there are problems there are tiny fill-in, vertically polarised antennae. Where signals from The Wrekin or Sutton Coldfield are unavailable Stoke-on-Trent and Newcastle Under-Lyme are served by the Berry Hill TV transmitter in Fenton. But there's one annomaly - Biddulph is a Midlands town that gets much clearer TV pics from Winter Hill but is absolutely not covered by the BBC in the North West. By contrast Granada and Central cross each others borders quite regularly. It's been known for Central to dispatch a crew to Northwich which is at least 20 miles inside the North West. And they say the Beeb's overstaffed!
It's been known for Central to dispatch a crew to Northwich which is at least 20 miles inside the North West. And they say the Beeb's overstaffed!
Really? That's interesting, I could understand Crewe or Whitchurch, but Northwich? Saying that Northwich rarely gets a mention on NWT or Granada Reports, but Central, I'd have thought it's a little too North for them.
Oddly I remember at my girlfriend's old house their aerial was rather odd, the picture wasn't 100% on the normal channels yet we could get Wales clearly, and watchable Central and Yorkshire which was really odd...
It's been known for Central to dispatch a crew to Northwich which is at least 20 miles inside the North West. And they say the Beeb's overstaffed!
Really? That's interesting, I could understand Crewe or Whitchurch, but Northwich? Saying that Northwich rarely gets a mention on NWT or Granada Reports, but Central, I'd have thought it's a little too North for them.
Oddly I remember at my girlfriend's old house their aerial was rather odd, the picture wasn't 100% on the normal channels yet we could get Wales clearly, and watchable Central and Yorkshire which was really odd...
Admittedly the Central news team's sojourn to mid Cheshire was for a murder. Even so, It was way out of their patch. I was living in Birmigham at the time (tho' I'm North West born and bred) and thought it more than a little odd. The thing is, I'm less convinced there's a good reason for indies to cross each other's borders than for the Beeb. BBC newsrooms stay within their borders parsimoniously because they're told to do so. The indies need bums on seats in their own TSAs - not over the border where they're not counted. So why waste money and effort on a story that won't put on even one extra viewer? BTW I've checked the status of Biddulph - it's deffo in Midlands Today's patch. It's just that the TV antenna installers, taking signal strength into account, don't agree!
MO
morgaineofevil
Heather Stott presenting the weather on NWT today is that now a permanent fixture, i did read that all the radio sklots were being moved making Dianne unavailable to do the weather.
! The reason they pick up Winter Hill is topographics. Buxton/Glossop lies to the west of the Pennines so the signals from Waltham* or Emley Moor are blocked. However there are no hills between the western edge of High Peak and Winter Hill to block the signal (bearing in mind Greater Manchester lies in a relatively low-lying plane).