BA
Surely you're not saying that the flood defences and the Environment Agency have made no difference? The results of this event were nothing like what happened 60 years ago.
Not really, people's homes still fell into the sea.
Surely you're not saying that the flood defences and the Environment Agency have made no difference? The results of this event were nothing like what happened 60 years ago.
TM
Explain to me why it would have been inappropriate for the News Channel to opt out of the rolling Mandela coverage for 10 minutes per hour to cover other matters, especially once Newsnight was on air with alternative in depth coverage.
I realise this probably makes me sound like a broken record, but I can think of several good reasons why the News Channel may have thought it inappropriate to cut away from rolling Mandela coverage.
I think viewers tuning into any news channel have a reasonable expectation to see a major news story (especially one of international significance), covered on a rolling basis, particularly when it is still considered to be ‘breaking’. Had the News Channel opted-out for even ten minutes, any viewers tuning in for Mandela coverage during that period would simply have switched away (as existing viewers may have done), and probably wondered why the BBC was cutting to a domestic story which, with all due respect, was only really relevant to fairly localised areas of England.
It’s also worth pointing out that the BBC has generally struggled with its reputation for handling breaking news, with the News Channel consistantly trailling behind Sky News – at least in terms of audience perception. It’s a point Richard Lambert made when he reviewed the performance of BBC News 24 back in 2002. Obviouly, the News Channel has improved massively since those early days, but I think the BBC is still quite sensitive to the criticism, and this might also have informed its decision to stick with Mandela. Plus, it can’t be a coincidence that just about every news channel I saw on the night (certainly Sky, CNN and Aljazeera) did the same.
With regards Newsnight, its remit is quite distinct from that of a rolling news channel. As you say, it provided in-depth analysis – but I don’t think that is something viewers necessarily expect from a rolling news channel, where the focus tends to be on breaking news and showing the latest pictures instead (rather than quite high-brow studio discussions).
What people will recall 10 years hence is, with respect, not really that relevant. And they would remember it just the same regardless of whether brief round-ups of other news were included.
Well, when you put it that way, I'm inclined to agree with you. I stand corrected …
Explain to me why it would have been inappropriate for the News Channel to opt out of the rolling Mandela coverage for 10 minutes per hour to cover other matters, especially once Newsnight was on air with alternative in depth coverage.
I realise this probably makes me sound like a broken record, but I can think of several good reasons why the News Channel may have thought it inappropriate to cut away from rolling Mandela coverage.
I think viewers tuning into any news channel have a reasonable expectation to see a major news story (especially one of international significance), covered on a rolling basis, particularly when it is still considered to be ‘breaking’. Had the News Channel opted-out for even ten minutes, any viewers tuning in for Mandela coverage during that period would simply have switched away (as existing viewers may have done), and probably wondered why the BBC was cutting to a domestic story which, with all due respect, was only really relevant to fairly localised areas of England.
It’s also worth pointing out that the BBC has generally struggled with its reputation for handling breaking news, with the News Channel consistantly trailling behind Sky News – at least in terms of audience perception. It’s a point Richard Lambert made when he reviewed the performance of BBC News 24 back in 2002. Obviouly, the News Channel has improved massively since those early days, but I think the BBC is still quite sensitive to the criticism, and this might also have informed its decision to stick with Mandela. Plus, it can’t be a coincidence that just about every news channel I saw on the night (certainly Sky, CNN and Aljazeera) did the same.
With regards Newsnight, its remit is quite distinct from that of a rolling news channel. As you say, it provided in-depth analysis – but I don’t think that is something viewers necessarily expect from a rolling news channel, where the focus tends to be on breaking news and showing the latest pictures instead (rather than quite high-brow studio discussions).
What people will recall 10 years hence is, with respect, not really that relevant. And they would remember it just the same regardless of whether brief round-ups of other news were included.
Well, when you put it that way, I'm inclined to agree with you. I stand corrected …
Last edited by Telly Media on 12 December 2013 10:21pm
DE
Interesting that a special question time came from Johannesburg tonight. Clearly from a tv studio too, presumably because it would come with production facilities. I think the last time QT came from a studio was the infamous one from TC4 (?) which had Nick Griffin on the panel, though AIUI TC was chosen for that particular show because of the inherent security the centre provided. Was it an SABC studio?
CR
Probably the best Question Time in a long while. Very interesting comments from the audience, and quite a different atmosphere to a normal edition - audience were much more vocal, and poor Dimbleby's cries for 'the man in third row, no not you in the fourth row, the man in the, oh alright' made quite a change from him being in control of everything. Was it broadcast live? I also noticed that some African drums made an appearance to spice up the title music, and the set itself was enlarged, although the general layout the same (I presume they built a new desk in SA?)
The audience even got up and started stacking the chairs at the end during the credits.
The audience even got up and started stacking the chairs at the end during the credits.
MA
No, Urban Brew Studios
http://www.urbanbrew.tv/#/#who
They are in the Randburg district of JoBurg, virtually next door to M-NET/SuperSport's
large campus, they get a lot of overspill work from that broadcaster.
It was an excellent edition, only spoilt by poor studio acoustics, particularly at the beginning
I suspect the BBC had planned to do this a long time ago, as part of their forward planning for Mandela's death,
so they probably built the set and shipped it down there months ago ?
I'm not sure, but I think it may have been recorded on Tuesday, because one of the panellists
referred to 'today' when talking about the memorial service ?
Interesting that a special question time came from Johannesburg tonight. Clearly from a tv studio too, presumably because it would come with production facilities. I think the last time QT came from a studio was the infamous one from TC4 (?) which had Nick Griffin on the panel, though AIUI TC was chosen for that particular show because of the inherent security the centre provided. Was it an SABC studio?
No, Urban Brew Studios
http://www.urbanbrew.tv/#/#who
They are in the Randburg district of JoBurg, virtually next door to M-NET/SuperSport's
large campus, they get a lot of overspill work from that broadcaster.
It was an excellent edition, only spoilt by poor studio acoustics, particularly at the beginning
I suspect the BBC had planned to do this a long time ago, as part of their forward planning for Mandela's death,
so they probably built the set and shipped it down there months ago ?
I'm not sure, but I think it may have been recorded on Tuesday, because one of the panellists
referred to 'today' when talking about the memorial service ?
Last edited by Markymark on 13 December 2013 3:41pm
FL
On a normal night when BBC World News gallery breakaway the WN channel for a pre recorded program the same BBC World News crew are still in editorial and gallery charge of the domestic news channel, everyone else is gone.
Ever since the rebrand from BBC News 24 and BBC World to BBC News and BBC World News, editorial control of the News channel between 1am and 6am was handed over from News 24 over to World News as most nights their's is the biggest audience. This normally works fine as whenever the gallery put out a pre record out on the World News channel, they can then get on with producing a bulletin or rolling coverage for the domestic channel.(Example, night of the Helicopter crash in Glasgow) However on the night in question, Nelson Mandella had died. Every rival of BBC World News was providing wall to wall coverage of this historic event so the person in charge of BBC World News decided to do the same or else they may lose backing of their sponsors or get dropped by tv companies, particularly in Africa which is a big market for them. Unfortunately back in London, everyone who could run the domestic News channel separate to World News was going home for the night like they always do because the BBC can't afford to pay them huge overtime. So before 1am they breakaway from the rolling coverage to advise people to stay tuned to local radio stations for the latest on the storms. That's as much as they can do. The BBC can't afford a domestic News channel between the hours of 1am and 8am so they pay BBC World News to produce it themselves, for the most part it works but the death of Mandella is an extraordinary event. There will be no breakaway on BBC World News, no breaks or pre recorded material.
You do realise the NC overnights are not a simulcast don't you? There are lots of differences between the World and NC outputs.
On a normal night when BBC World News gallery breakaway the WN channel for a pre recorded program the same BBC World News crew are still in editorial and gallery charge of the domestic news channel, everyone else is gone.
Ever since the rebrand from BBC News 24 and BBC World to BBC News and BBC World News, editorial control of the News channel between 1am and 6am was handed over from News 24 over to World News as most nights their's is the biggest audience. This normally works fine as whenever the gallery put out a pre record out on the World News channel, they can then get on with producing a bulletin or rolling coverage for the domestic channel.(Example, night of the Helicopter crash in Glasgow) However on the night in question, Nelson Mandella had died. Every rival of BBC World News was providing wall to wall coverage of this historic event so the person in charge of BBC World News decided to do the same or else they may lose backing of their sponsors or get dropped by tv companies, particularly in Africa which is a big market for them. Unfortunately back in London, everyone who could run the domestic News channel separate to World News was going home for the night like they always do because the BBC can't afford to pay them huge overtime. So before 1am they breakaway from the rolling coverage to advise people to stay tuned to local radio stations for the latest on the storms. That's as much as they can do. The BBC can't afford a domestic News channel between the hours of 1am and 8am so they pay BBC World News to produce it themselves, for the most part it works but the death of Mandella is an extraordinary event. There will be no breakaway on BBC World News, no breaks or pre recorded material.
GE
Sunday's funeral coverage on BBC One has appeared on EPG's this morning:
BBC One 6.00am - 10.30am, with David Dimbleby
According to the BBC's online listings pages, Breakfast moves to BBC Two from 6am-7.35am, followed by the Match of the Day repeat, The Andrew Marr Show and Fern Britton Meets, and Breakfast runs as normal on the BBC News Channel. Although, unless they don't want a repeat of the 'overkill' accusations, I'd be surprised if the News Channel doesn't take the Dimbleby programme.
BBC One 6.00am - 10.30am, with David Dimbleby
According to the BBC's online listings pages, Breakfast moves to BBC Two from 6am-7.35am, followed by the Match of the Day repeat, The Andrew Marr Show and Fern Britton Meets, and Breakfast runs as normal on the BBC News Channel. Although, unless they don't want a repeat of the 'overkill' accusations, I'd be surprised if the News Channel doesn't take the Dimbleby programme.
GH
Very dissapointing that they are using Dimbley. I wondered if they would send Huw Edwards out, but expected them to just do it with George Alagiah and Jon Sopel.
DI
*DIMBLEGLARE*
Very dissapointing that they are using Dimbley. I wondered if they would send Huw Edwards out, but expected them to just do it with George Alagiah and Jon Sopel.
*DIMBLEGLARE*
SP
Thanks for that considered reply (if that comes across as sarcastic I can assure you it isn't meant to). I can see some merit in what you say. I still think there is a compelling argument for having something a bit more balanced on at least one of the BBC's outlets - or at the very least making sure the regions did their opt on time. In the same way that people expecting Mandela coverage would expect it to be on the News Channel, I think people interested in the storms would have a similar expectation. It's a shame that some way to accommodate both couldn't be found.
I realise this probably makes me sound like a broken record, but I can think of several good reasons why the News Channel may have thought it inappropriate to cut away from rolling Mandela coverage.
[snip]
[snip]
Thanks for that considered reply (if that comes across as sarcastic I can assure you it isn't meant to). I can see some merit in what you say. I still think there is a compelling argument for having something a bit more balanced on at least one of the BBC's outlets - or at the very least making sure the regions did their opt on time. In the same way that people expecting Mandela coverage would expect it to be on the News Channel, I think people interested in the storms would have a similar expectation. It's a shame that some way to accommodate both couldn't be found.