The Newsroom

BBC News 24: Presentation discussion

Graphics & set related (January 2008)

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NG
noggin Founding member
nwtv2003 posted:

Ceefax although as popular and as useful it is, the technology is over 30 years old now, it's outdated and can be quite slow when you want to select a page and the fact you cannot chose a sub page really puts me off it. Granted maybe the BBC should consider using the Ceefax branding instead of BBCi for a litlte bit of continuity, as long as people are made aware of BBCi replacing Ceefax post DSO, I don't see an issue.


To be fair - most modern Teletext decoders in TVs cache pages so page selection can often be nearly instant - though sub pages are still an issue.

BBCi initially had a very dogmatic approach and didn't have page numbers - but since they realised people actually liked them more than being forced to click through multiple menus - it has become much more usable. The satellite version is currently a bit slow - but the Freeview version on a decent receiver is surprisingly quick.

The one issue that BBCi has traditionally had is that once you start looking at a page it doesn't update - so sport scores, flight information etc. were not as functional as CEEFAX. It IS possible to do this in a different application - which is what the interactive TV applications do - but this is a major functionality issue. I imagine taxi firms using CEEFAX flight information to track arrivals will miss it most post-DSO.
SP
Spencer
noggin posted:
The one issue that BBCi has traditionally had is that once you start looking at a page it doesn't update - so sport scores, flight information etc. were not as functional as CEEFAX. It IS possible to do this in a different application - which is what the interactive TV applications do - but this is a major functionality issue. I imagine taxi firms using CEEFAX flight information to track arrivals will miss it most post-DSO.


Are you sure this is still the case? I know it used to be, but recently I've definitely had BBCi pages change whilst I've been viewing them (on DSat). This has typically happened when viewing a news page, and the story has changed to a different one without my pressing anything. I figured this probably happens when the menu order is changed. I assumed they must have incorporated some kind of 'refresh' function.
ZS
ZiggyShadowDust
At around 11:45 the BBC World dog was up on News 24.
BR
Brekkie
No reason at all Teletext/Ceefax should continue when the digital equivalent can be much more user friendly - the problem is though that BBCi is just very very bad.


Both Teletext and Sky have digital services which operate very much like the old analogue systems, with the addition of all the advantages of digital text.


BBCi though is clunky and very unuser friendly. Yes, they've added page numbers to indexes, but not all these are the same as on Ceefax (i.e. Rugby on Ceefax p370, on BBCi Union is p368, League p375). There's also the four digit systems which add unnecessary further confusion.

A lack of page numbers for individual stories doesn't help too, meaning to navigate from one story to another you either have to return to the menu or go through the stories until you find it, while with Teletext and Sky you can just go straight there with the number.

The same applies to things like football tables and weather forecasts - you always have to navigate from a menu.
GS
Gavin Scott Founding member
Brekkie posted:
No reason at all Teletext/Ceefax should continue when the digital equivalent can be much more user friendly - the problem is though that BBCi is just very very bad.


In your opinion. I don't think so.

Quote:
BBCi though is clunky and very unuser friendly. Yes, they've added page numbers to indexes, but not all these are the same as on Ceefax (i.e. Rugby on Ceefax p370, on BBCi Union is p368, League p375). There's also the four digit systems which add unnecessary further confusion.


Confusion my arse. I can't remember the last time I saw Ceefax. I certainly don't expect to remember the old number system or even for it to match up with the new one.

Its not a perfect system but its really quite good in places.
BR
Brekkie
Gavin Scott posted:
Brekkie posted:
No reason at all Teletext/Ceefax should continue when the digital equivalent can be much more user friendly - the problem is though that BBCi is just very very bad.


In your opinion. I don't think so.

Quote:
BBCi though is clunky and very unuser friendly. Yes, they've added page numbers to indexes, but not all these are the same as on Ceefax (i.e. Rugby on Ceefax p370, on BBCi Union is p368, League p375). There's also the four digit systems which add unnecessary further confusion.


Confusion my arse. I can't remember the last time I saw Ceefax. I certainly don't expect to remember the old number system or even for it to match up with the new one.



You don't, but most Ceefax users would expect a similar page numbering system to be in place, especially as Teletext's service is basically lifted from analogue to digital.


BTW, one thing which really annoys me about BBCi is how "News Headlines" is hardly ever listed on the bridge - usually it's "News Multiscreen" then options for sport, weather etc. - when you'd think the news headlines would be one of the most prominent features of the text service.
CH
Chie
Wow. 59 second countdown just before 1am this morning. Quite rare.
JO
Joshua
The ticker writing is now in lower-case. I wonder why? Looks very different - and its funny that its breaking news aswell!

Edit: Just changed to upper-case again.
JF
JamesyFish
josh205 posted:
The ticker writing is now in lower-case. I wonder why? Looks very different - and its funny that its breaking news aswell!

Edit: Just changed to upper-case again.


Any caps of this?
DA
Davidjb Founding member
goldfish97 posted:
josh205 posted:
The ticker writing is now in lower-case. I wonder why? Looks very different - and its funny that its breaking news aswell!

Edit: Just changed to upper-case again.


Any caps of this?


It did this the other day too. It was only the breaking news section that was all in lower case, all other segments were in caps!
MI
m_in_m
Could it be as simple as someone typed in lower case by mistake?
DA
Davidjb Founding member
m_in_m posted:
Could it be as simple as someone typed in lower case by mistake?


More than likely. The breaking news text is not typed when the rest of the ticker gets updated so could just be whoever does it has forgotten on more than one occasion this week to put caps on. Breaking News straps often have typo's in them as the people are trying to get the text in vision as soon as possible. Usually gets updated pretty quickly though if something is spelt incorrectly or typed wrong. I can only assume the breaking news ticker being in lower case is an error as surely common sense would put all standard ticker sectors in lower case with breaking news being upper case for attention?! This is of course only my view.

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