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'Rota' talk on this site

Split from TV Forum: New for (the middle of) 2020

IT
itsrobert Founding member Granada North West Today
Genuinely not trying to be provocative for the sake of it here but having only ever been used to the 'mega-thread' style (I recall the 'Daybreak' thread having three figures of pages when I joined up in 2013), I really don't quite understand what's expected of us any more.

There were some minor changes to GMB this morning in that they began using a different split screen graphic for Piers and Susanna so that, like a few other programmes, they appear to be sitting next to each other despite, in reality, being distanced.

This isn't a massive topic for extended discussion and certainly isn't worthy of a thread in its own right but it's the kind of thing which some people would be interested to know had changed, but there's now nowhere to post this, to the extent that it's been referred to in the This Morning thread since the GMB one has been closed.

Where exactly are we supposed to post these little bits of information which are worth mentioning but certainly not worthy of their own thread if there's no longer a general thread for programmes like Good Morning Britain and Loose Women?

Previously, if you were interested in Loose Women or GMB, you'd go to their dedicated threads to read about them. If you weren't interested in those programmes, you wouldn't read those threads. Surely that's a sensible system as it is? There are a number of threads which I never read, because I don't personally have any interest in that topic/programme, but I understand that others must find this to be interesting and therefore I merely skip over it. I don't understand why people cannot do the same with the two ITV Daytime threads which have been closed.

Now that the GMB and Loose Women threads have been closed down, people who are interested in those shows now find themselves unable to discuss these programmes, and people who aren't interested in them will stumble upon bits and pieces posted in the 'wrong' places, e.g. the talk of GMB's new split screen appearing in the This Morning thread today due to the lack of a dedicated space for this discussion.

I'm struggling to understand (a) how this is supposed to be an improvement, (b) how we're supposed to post these little day-to-day updates post-thread-closures?

Just seems like because a few people were 'boring people' by talking about rotas in a few threads, the many people who enjoyed reading/contributing to those threads generally are being punished, and I'm afraid that doesn't sit right with me at all.

Genuine question - what's wrong with creating a new thread for that? "New split screen on GMB". Post a screengrab of it. That seems right on topic for TV Forum. You might get a few replies/a bit of discussion if people have something to say. If not, it's been noted and is a lot more visible than it was being buried in a massive thread and will die quickly if no-one is interested.

I really do understand the apprehension with that approach as we've been conditioned to use mega threads for donkey's years. But, go back to the first few pages of topics in 2001 and you will see that people just started new threads when there was something to note or a question to ask. The threads tended to be shorter in some cases but personally I think that would be better than wading through huge threads.

Maybe there's no right way to do this and obviously there would need to be a consensus and Asa's agreement as to the final approach. It's just another way of thinking about things.
SW
Steve Williams
The fact that people want to know who's presented Loose Women but don't seem to be interested in actually watching it just proves the point, really.


Well, this is the thing, isn't it? It's just something to note down for the sake of it.

I mean, I'm a fine one to talk here because I'm a regular in the DigitalSpy Commentators Thread, and every season I compile a list of all the Match of the Day commentators. But the difference there, I think, is that I only do it once a season, at which point I think it can generate some debate, and also I think commentators are a bit different because they all have different styles and they're all ad-libbing, whereas one newsreader reading the news off the autocue is very much like any other newsreader. And also, I actually do it myself by watching the programmes, I feel if I turned up there every week saying "Who did Palace vs Southampton on MOTD?" just so I could write it down for my own self-interest I might start getting short shrift.

It all depends on what can generate worthwhile debate, isn't it? Just saying "Martine Croxall is on the news channel at the moment" doesn't do that. The only discussion that can generate is by asking "Why is she on there?" or "Why isn't (other presenter) on there instead?", which is impossible to answer, because nobody on here knows. Half the time, the news channels themselves just want to make sure they have a presenter, any presenter.

It's not just rota talk, of course, it's anything that just revolves around knowing stuff for the sake of knowing it. It's like that thread from a few years ago from a previous member when BBC1 started the Love X campaign and they would pop up every five minutes to say "What ident did they just use?" or "BBC1 Scotland just used this ident", for no reason other than to have a record of it all. Again, that doesn't generate debate, you can discuss the general quality of the idents, but just saying "They showed this ident, why didn't they show this one" doesn't do that, because the answer is pretty much always "because that's the ident they decided to use". You may as well ask why I'm wearing these particular socks today and not any of my other ones. Similarly the endless discussion on here back when BBC News was in TVC about the two virtually identical backdrops and why they were using backdrop A in a slot where they usually used backdrop B.

I think the rule of thumb has to be if it will generate debate, which just listing things doesn't do. The only responses to a post like "Jame Moore is in chair 3 on Loose Women today" are either "so what?" or "why isn't she in chair 4/why isn't someone else in chair 3?" which is totally unanswerable.
WH
Whataday Founding member Wales Wales Today
I think people are exaggerating the degree of "who's sitting in which seat" discussion which took place in the Loose Women thread. As I said, the last few months has been a time of notable change, whether it's coming off air during the pandemic and their moving to TC1 along with the various other social distancing measures when they returned, and adding BAME hosts to the host lineup. The suggestion that it was a daily diary of who sat where is not accurate.

It's fine if this sort of discussion is now out of bounds, because that could improve the overall quality of the forum, but as has been said there needs to be a degree of consistency.
NL
Ne1L C Recently warned Yorkshire Look North (Yorkshire)
Pete posted:
You're never going to have full consistency, just as we don't over the road with a dedicated morrisons and dedicated non-morrisons thread*

And I think that's fine. But the rota logging has got to stop, it sucks the life from every thread. If you allow rota chat in a Loose Women thread it'll seep into every other one over time. That's where the consistency needs to be.

*Also of course some threads are Official, whereas others are not Wink


Its pernickety and a waste of time and bandwidth. Nevertheless there are many who feel its worth noting. Now whilst that may ok for the completionist element on TV Forum for the rest of us its brain-numbing. There has to be a middle ground somewhere.
JO
Joe
This isn't a massive topic for extended discussion and certainly isn't worthy of a thread in its own right but it's the kind of thing which some people would be interested to know had changed, but there's now nowhere to post this, to the extent that it's been referred to in the This Morning thread since the GMB one has been closed.

Genuine question - what's wrong with creating a new thread for that? "New split screen on GMB". Post a screengrab of it. That seems right on topic for TV Forum. You might get a few replies/a bit of discussion if people have something to say. If not, it's been noted and is a lot more visible than it was being buried in a massive thread and will die quickly if no-one is interested.

Totally agree with all you said in your post. Smaller threads are more fun, more focussed and less likely to suck everything not worth talking about (i.e. rotas) like a black hole. Go ahead and post about that minor change!
AN
Andrew Founding member Yorkshire Look North (Yorkshire)
I see no issue with some general mega threads, the alternative is like you get in certain parts of DS, where people start a new thread for every slight thought, and as a result good threads sink to page two, and die a death, and the whole first page is full of threads with just a few posts

The ITV programming thread for example is for stuff that is worth a slight comment on, but hardly worth a new thread

To be fair, besides the far too detailed rota chat and the endless questions about why a rota has panned out as it has, most threads work fairly well here.

I'm a member of another forum about a completely different subject matter, where off topic discussion is slapped down immediately, and when a topic is said to have run its course (which in our world would be say 1 week after new idents launch), its locked. Here off topic discussion can often lead to better debate than what the thread was originally about, and is more likely to grow organically than someone starting a thread about that specific point.

I'm thinking Asa needs to do an "embarrassing U-turn" on Loose Women and GMB threads though!
Last edited by Andrew on 15 September 2020 4:42pm
BBI45, Londoner and DavidWhitfield gave kudos
PE
Pete Founding member North Reporting Scotland
Similarly the endless discussion on here back when BBC News was in TVC about the two virtually identical backdrops and why they were using backdrop A in a slot where they usually used backdrop B.


oh I'd forgotten about that nightmare.

Re: the Loose Women and GMB threads though. Surely if something interesting happens someone can start a new thread. The whole thing is this is a shot across the bows re: rota nonsense and endless threads.

And if I see a new splitscreen on News 24 I can start a new thread and if someone replies with "this should be in the general thread" I can be like jog on we're having a new thread for this cheers.
ELM 2011: I am sick of been persicuted by you immature TV Forumers!
SS
SuperSajuuk North Reporting Scotland
I'm not a long time member of this community so I can't really provide an objective opinion on this topic, but I am ambivalent to megathreads and rota talk. I agree however, the rota talk gets way out of hand, but I don't think megathreads are a terrible thing that are so bad that they must be locked and banned from the community. Sure they don't engender a lot of discussion, but at least it allows for dumping of "minor information" without creating a whole thread. I don't believe that every thread "has" to engender some sort of discussion, there are plenty of things that are just simply "making a note of something" rather than intended to spark a 50 page debate on that topic.

I do agree with those other opinions from users like itsrobert and Brekkie that perhaps they've outlived their usefulness and I don't mind either way as to how they are sorted out on the forum.
FR
freddied056 Meridian (South) South Today
Genuinely not trying to be provocative for the sake of it here but having only ever been used to the 'mega-thread' style (I recall the 'Daybreak' thread having three figures of pages when I joined up in 2013), I really don't quite understand what's expected of us any more.

There were some minor changes to GMB this morning in that they began using a different split screen graphic for Piers and Susanna so that, like a few other programmes, they appear to be sitting next to each other despite, in reality, being distanced.

This isn't a massive topic for extended discussion and certainly isn't worthy of a thread in its own right but it's the kind of thing which some people would be interested to know had changed, but there's now nowhere to post this, to the extent that it's been referred to in the This Morning thread since the GMB one has been closed.

Where exactly are we supposed to post these little bits of information which are worth mentioning but certainly not worthy of their own thread if there's no longer a general thread for programmes like Good Morning Britain and Loose Women?

Previously, if you were interested in Loose Women or GMB, you'd go to their dedicated threads to read about them. If you weren't interested in those programmes, you wouldn't read those threads. Surely that's a sensible system as it is? There are a number of threads which I never read, because I don't personally have any interest in that topic/programme, but I understand that others must find this to be interesting and therefore I merely skip over it. I don't understand why people cannot do the same with the two ITV Daytime threads which have been closed.

Now that the GMB and Loose Women threads have been closed down, people who are interested in those shows now find themselves unable to discuss these programmes, and people who aren't interested in them will stumble upon bits and pieces posted in the 'wrong' places, e.g. the talk of GMB's new split screen appearing in the This Morning thread today due to the lack of a dedicated space for this discussion.

I'm struggling to understand (a) how this is supposed to be an improvement, (b) how we're supposed to post these little day-to-day updates post-thread-closures?

Just seems like because a few people were 'boring people' by talking about rotas in a few threads, the many people who enjoyed reading/contributing to those threads generally are being punished, and I'm afraid that doesn't sit right with me at all.

Agreed. I’d like the GMB thread back - otherwise GMB stuff goes in the wrong places, leading to more arguments.
IT
itsrobert Founding member Granada North West Today
Maybe the answer then is a middle ground?

We keep the non-rota mega threads but we all think a bit more carefully about what we post in them. Rota talk and effectively stalking presenters should be 100% banned through swift moderation. The rest of the mega threads can therefore remain in situ, without rota talk, to be a place to discuss genuine TV pres miscellany. But we should all feel a bit more able to create a new thread when something even a little bit more significant happens. That way, it has the advantage of really highlighting something that might be of wider interest.

For instance, I don't read the Central West and Midlands thread, nor a handful of others, simply because I have no interest in them. But if the studio burned down, I'd definitely want to know that, so it should go in a new thread for mass appeal. We've ended up being stuck in a bit of a rut in these straightjacket threads for each programme and the thread just becomes almost a stream of consciousness about the subject of the thread.

Does that sound like a workable compromise?
PE
Pete Founding member North Reporting Scotland
You know I'm enjoying things just as they are now. I'm finding the forum really easy to read compared to how its been.

I'd suggest that we keep the avoidance megathreads for now and see how it pans out? I'd have never known about these split screen things for nicer framing if they'd been buried in the GMB or This Morning threads. seeing it as its own I find far better.
ELM 2011: I am sick of been persicuted by you immature TV Forumers!
JB
JasonB London London
The GMB thread is quite useful with knowing when Piers Morgan is going to be on holiday in advance so I can tune in on those dates.
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