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'Rota' talk on this site

Split from TV Forum: New for (the middle of) 2020

NL
Ne1L C Yorkshire Look North (Yorkshire)
Pete posted:
Rota talk bores me rigid, as does pages on minor logo changes, but logging into the main forums tonight with multiple threads now locked it feels like we're in a discussion forum where discussion is no longer allowed.

Frankly there is not enough happening in the world of presentation alone at the moment for a long established community to discuss on a daily basis - it just doesn't evolve in the way it once did, and although that area should always be the backbone of this forum it feels too narrow a brief for the forum to be the engaging community it can be.


I mean that's bc it literally happened today. I think you've got to balance it with the fact that when I visit TVF and see a whole page of green threads, I don't find myself excited to read it. I find myself filled with dread at having to trudge through the guff to find something worthwhile. I'd much rather have 1/3 less posts if the 2/3 that are left are interesting.



Quality will always beat quantity. Like you I hate having to scroll past pages of c**p.
IT
itsrobert Founding member Granada North West Today
I would just like to commend Asa for recognising this problem and taking steps to start addressing it. As some may already know, I took the decision a couple of weeks ago to step back from TV Forum and have some self-imposed breathing space for the first time in almost 20 years. TV Forum has been a daily part of my life since its very first day on the internet and it really is a part of my life I don't want to give up. The amount of enjoyment I have derived from the site in that time is immeasurable. I've made some very dear friends here. And it was for this reason I was so saddened to see some long-term members leave in August. The shock of it, and the gaping holes such losses leave, really hit me.

Asa and I discussed this privately at the time and I raised some concerns about the colonisation of the forum by rota talk and also the problem of fairly light-touch moderation. I am very glad to see that others feel the same way and that I wasn't somehow out of step with the general consensus. I didn't come to this opinion lightly and publicly posting about it on Metropol was an even bigger step as I have always vowed not to be a backseat driver ever since I stepped down as a moderator myself. What concerned me was that rota discussion was sucking the life out of previously interesting threads and that light-touch moderation was leading to topics going astray and not being brought back into line quickly enough. This, in turn, leads to arguments as old timers get riled and eventually snap and get banned.

For these reasons, I think the steps Asa has taken today is a great start. I have never been a fan of the mega-threads. Back in the very early days, we didn't have them. Instead, members created a new topic if something interesting happened or they had a question to ask. And, as others have said, if the topic wasn't interesting, it quickly died. The problem with the mega-threads has always been that they encourage tedious discussion and can easily get side-tracked. I have lost count of the number of interesting discussions that have been cut dead by someone posting about rotas. Personally, I would much rather have more topics that are focused and interesting. Take for instance the various nostalgia threads - they have been very interesting because they had a clear focus and haven't been so easily derailed. The same goes for the September 11th thread. When I first saw it the other day, I thought it would be a bit pointless but it has actually turned out to be really interesting for the most part.

On that subject, I know I am guilty of indulging in quite a lot of reminiscing about TV presentation from years ago and I'm probably not that interested in modern TV presentation as I was. Maybe that's just because presentation was so much better in the past? But I do think both nostalgic and contemporary discussions have a place and can cohabitate and I think the closure of the mega-threads is the right way to go here. I am probably still interested in following contemporary matters, but not the day-to-day tedium that has taken over recently. If something genuinely out of the ordinary has happened - start a new thread. That way, it doesn't get immediately buried in a mega-thread and might generate a bit more discussion in its own thread.

I really don't want to leave TV Forum. It's been too big a part of my life. Indeed, I've been here for more than half of my entire life! Since my self-imposed break, I have still been visiting and reading daily. I've just thought a bit more about whether to post and I think that's a good lesson for us all. Maybe if we all work together - posting sensibly, fewer mega-threads, a willingness to create new threads, and a little bit more timely moderation - we can make TV Forum last another 20 years.
VM
VMPhil Granada North West Today
Pete posted:
Rota talk bores me rigid, as does pages on minor logo changes, but logging into the main forums tonight with multiple threads now locked it feels like we're in a discussion forum where discussion is no longer allowed.

Frankly there is not enough happening in the world of presentation alone at the moment for a long established community to discuss on a daily basis - it just doesn't evolve in the way it once did, and although that area should always be the backbone of this forum it feels too narrow a brief for the forum to be the engaging community it can be.


I mean that's bc it literally happened today. I think you've got to balance it with the fact that when I visit TVF and see a whole page of green threads, I don't find myself excited to read it. I find myself filled with dread at having to trudge through the guff to find something worthwhile. I'd much rather have 1/3 less posts if the 2/3 that are left are interesting.

This, so much. It's less so now, but at the height of lockdown it was a real drag seeing an entire page of threads with new posts, and my reaction not being 'oh good!' but 'oh god'.
IT
itsrobert Founding member Granada North West Today
Asa posted:
I'm not entirely sure why anyone is discussing Loose Women on here to be honest. I know they had a couple of new looks in quite a short space of time but it doesn't feel like a thread that really belongs here.

That has always baffled me - we are surely as far away from the target audience as possible considering the membership here is largely male.

Asa posted:
There's a forum I came across the other day where off-topic comments were hidden behind a link, a bit like the spoiler tag, which is maybe an effective tool as a first step. If we're getting a number of off-topic posts from a poster then action can start to be taken.

I like that idea - the BGT posts yesterday which undoubtedly strayed off topic is a good example where that would work. Also as mentioned above I've not liked it when people in some cases have shared quite personal feelings about the Coronavirus situation only to have their posts wiped, and that would be a fair compromise. On the whole though a "move along" warning from the moderator rather than nuking the posts concerns seems the fairest way to move forward.


Maybe generic threads actually now are the problem rather than the solution to keeping discussion flowing and fresh, so arguably if it's not worthy of a new thread it's not worthy of discussion.

I absolutely agree, Brekkie. You've hit the nail on the head with everything there.
NL
Ne1L C Yorkshire Look North (Yorkshire)
The mega threads are quite frankly as boring as hell and seem to be an OCD paradise. I’ve already stated I’m autistic and do notice changes in music and formats but the minutest changes go above my head.

As brekkie said earlier presentation issues have ground to a halt to the point where even the most insignificant changes are seized upon and stretch it out to frankly ridiculous levels.
IT
itsrobert Founding member Granada North West Today
Pete posted:
Rota talk bores me rigid, as does pages on minor logo changes, but logging into the main forums tonight with multiple threads now locked it feels like we're in a discussion forum where discussion is no longer allowed.

Frankly there is not enough happening in the world of presentation alone at the moment for a long established community to discuss on a daily basis - it just doesn't evolve in the way it once did, and although that area should always be the backbone of this forum it feels too narrow a brief for the forum to be the engaging community it can be.


I mean that's bc it literally happened today. I think you've got to balance it with the fact that when I visit TVF and see a whole page of green threads, I don't find myself excited to read it. I find myself filled with dread at having to trudge through the guff to find something worthwhile. I'd much rather have 1/3 less posts if the 2/3 that are left are interesting.

This, so much. It's less so now, but at the height of lockdown it was a real drag seeing an entire page of threads with new posts, and my reaction not being 'oh good!' but 'oh god'.

I felt the same way but I think that was because the mega-threads were so long and daunting to tackle because you knew you would have to wade through crap to get to some interesting nuggets. Don't you think it would be better if there was a page full of new threads that were shorter and more focused? That way you could easily skip the ones that don't interest you and there wouldn't be as much crap to wade through in the ones you do fancy reading.
NL
Ne1L C Yorkshire Look North (Yorkshire)
Would it help to have say a limit of 20 posts on potential mega threads. If the number went over 20 then the mods could close the thread and invite a new thread opened?
VM
VMPhil Granada North West Today
Pete posted:

I mean that's bc it literally happened today. I think you've got to balance it with the fact that when I visit TVF and see a whole page of green threads, I don't find myself excited to read it. I find myself filled with dread at having to trudge through the guff to find something worthwhile. I'd much rather have 1/3 less posts if the 2/3 that are left are interesting.

This, so much. It's less so now, but at the height of lockdown it was a real drag seeing an entire page of threads with new posts, and my reaction not being 'oh good!' but 'oh god'.

I felt the same way but I think that was because the mega-threads were so long and daunting to tackle because you knew you would have to wade through crap to get to some interesting nuggets. Don't you think it would be better if there was a page full of new threads that were shorter and more focused? That way you could easily skip the ones that don't interest you and there wouldn't be as much crap to wade through in the ones you do fancy reading.

Certainly, but the problem is getting people to overcome the fear of starting a new thread, since we've had this culture of megathreads for so long now. I think you almost fear getting told off for starting an insubstantial thread.
NL
Ne1L C Yorkshire Look North (Yorkshire)
We shouldn’t be afraid. A guiding hand is better than a punch in the face.
PE
Pete Founding member North Reporting Scotland
This, so much. It's less so now, but at the height of lockdown it was a real drag seeing an entire page of threads with new posts, and my reaction not being 'oh good!' but 'oh god'.

I felt the same way but I think that was because the mega-threads were so long and daunting to tackle because you knew you would have to wade through crap to get to some interesting nuggets. Don't you think it would be better if there was a page full of new threads that were shorter and more focused? That way you could easily skip the ones that don't interest you and there wouldn't be as much crap to wade through in the ones you do fancy reading.

Certainly, but the problem is getting people to overcome the fear of starting a new thread, since we've had this culture of megathreads for so long now. I think you almost fear getting told off for starting an insubstantial thread.


there's literally a warning screen built into this website when you reply to a long thread saying maybe start a new thread. mean honestly how often does sky news change that it needs a permanent thread. i believe it had a new studio in westminster? surely that is a new thread.
ELM 2011: I am sick of been persicuted by you immature TV Forumers!
bilky asko and itsrobert gave kudos
JA
james-2001 Central (East) East Midlands Today
Asa posted:
I'm not entirely sure why anyone is discussing Loose Women on here to be honest. I know they had a couple of new looks in quite a short space of time but it doesn't feel like a thread that really belongs here.

That has always baffled me - we are surely as far away from the target audience as possible considering the membership here is largely male.


And very few posts seem remotely interested in discussing the content of the show either. It's pretty much all about who's presenting and little else.
DO
dosxuk Yorkshire Look North (Yorkshire)
Pete posted:
mean honestly how often does sky news change that it needs a permanent thread. i believe it had a new studio in westminster? surely that is a new thread.


But then you battle against the tendancy of a lot of people here who want to put every topic into well defined boxes that already exist. The mega threads were good at mopping up the multitude of minutiae that used to fill the forums with one sentence questions and observations, but they've also acted to stifle the more interesting conversations that can develop. I'm not really sure where the boundary should lie though.

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