NG
noggin
Founding member
NG
Openers to ZDF's 7pm heute news, and its more in-depth counterpart, heute-journal, from early 2009, not long before they moved into the massive virtual studio that is still used today (the "green hell", as it is referred to within ZDF). Incidentally, the presenter of the 7pm news in the first clip, Steffen Seibert, is now a spokesperson for the German government. IMO, this look is far superior to what came after it, which is still (with some modifications) in use today.
It's amazing that ZDF spent so much money on great technology and kit and years later they still haven't managed to produce a virtual news set design and format that is in any way aesthetically pleasing or works particularly well... The terrible integration of real camera moves with virtual set moves is still horrible...
(That said - their previous set was very dated...)
noggin
Founding member
International News Presentation: Past and Present
Openers to ZDF's 7pm heute news, and its more in-depth counterpart, heute-journal, from early 2009, not long before they moved into the massive virtual studio that is still used today (the "green hell", as it is referred to within ZDF). Incidentally, the presenter of the 7pm news in the first clip, Steffen Seibert, is now a spokesperson for the German government. IMO, this look is far superior to what came after it, which is still (with some modifications) in use today.
It's amazing that ZDF spent so much money on great technology and kit and years later they still haven't managed to produce a virtual news set design and format that is in any way aesthetically pleasing or works particularly well... The terrible integration of real camera moves with virtual set moves is still horrible...
(That said - their previous set was very dated...)
NG
Have they done that recently - and was it for FA Cup stuff? Red Button - as in the linear channel - is being phased out slowly, and I think it is now no longer handled by Red Bee (aka Ericsson) and I'm not sure how easy it is to schedule change at short notice (and as you say it was already carrying other content).
Had the penalties finished by 2200?
noggin
Founding member
BBC News Channel Presentation - 21/03/16 onwards
Not quite the case - the BBC on occasion have shifted post match analysis to the red button in the event of an overrun.
Have they done that recently - and was it for FA Cup stuff? Red Button - as in the linear channel - is being phased out slowly, and I think it is now no longer handled by Red Bee (aka Ericsson) and I'm not sure how easy it is to schedule change at short notice (and as you say it was already carrying other content).
Had the penalties finished by 2200?
NG
No - that's not the case. This was an FA Cup replay (i.e. a repeat of a match played earlier that ended in a draw). This match was still a draw at full time, so that meant the match went to extra time (but this didn't give either side a win either), and so it then went to penalties. This is the joy of an FA Cup replay match - you don't know how long it will last, only when it will start. TV schedulers have to cope with this, and everyone is on standby for the various options (Full Time finish, Extra Time finish, or Penalties finish)
A lot of times when sports run late here in the US the post game show will be pushed to the channels associated sports network.
None of the terrestrial broadcasters in the UK have sport channels or networks (either Free to air or pay-TV), so that wouldn't be an option. They all have secondary general networks, but messily shifting the post-match analysis across and displacing other shows on a different network wouldn't be seen as any better.
noggin
Founding member
BBC News Channel Presentation - 21/03/16 onwards
I’m a bit confused as to what happened here based on what I’ve read on different threads. Based on what I’ve I read it sounds like the match was over (or close to it) and they still had the post game show to do?
No - that's not the case. This was an FA Cup replay (i.e. a repeat of a match played earlier that ended in a draw). This match was still a draw at full time, so that meant the match went to extra time (but this didn't give either side a win either), and so it then went to penalties. This is the joy of an FA Cup replay match - you don't know how long it will last, only when it will start. TV schedulers have to cope with this, and everyone is on standby for the various options (Full Time finish, Extra Time finish, or Penalties finish)
Quote:
A lot of times when sports run late here in the US the post game show will be pushed to the channels associated sports network.
None of the terrestrial broadcasters in the UK have sport channels or networks (either Free to air or pay-TV), so that wouldn't be an option. They all have secondary general networks, but messily shifting the post-match analysis across and displacing other shows on a different network wouldn't be seen as any better.
NG
Sounds as if this could be a bit like Sochi (and Vancouver?) - I suspect they will use the camera RF whenever possible, apart from when the weather is too bad (if it ever is). Interesting that there's studio presentation from MediaCity in Salford too. ISTR that the BBC used a London virtual studio for 1998, can't remember if they also did in 2002.
Running a single camera for roaming and chatting is far more flexible than having to run a single camera in a studio setup (particularly if you are doing interviews)
The BBC has traditionally used remote production techniques for the Winter Olympics (as Winter Sports is quite niche here) - Turin/Torino in 2006 had a multi-camera studio cut on-site, but the integration between this studio and the main OBS (if it was OBS then) host feeds and unilateral standup positions done in TC5 in London. (Turin was the first time that the BBC had full uncompressed SDI fibre feeds from site ISTR - with SDTI EVS integration too ?).
Vancouver was single camera roaming, as was Sochi, and both were integrated back in the UK 'remote production' style.
noggin
Founding member
Winter Olympics 2018
Here’s the BBC plans in detail. Their studio is in an apartment building and consists of a single camera.
https://www.sportsvideo.org/2018/01/16/pyeongchang-2018-bbc-sport-reveals-its-winter-olympics-plans/
https://www.sportsvideo.org/2018/01/16/pyeongchang-2018-bbc-sport-reveals-its-winter-olympics-plans/
Sounds as if this could be a bit like Sochi (and Vancouver?) - I suspect they will use the camera RF whenever possible, apart from when the weather is too bad (if it ever is). Interesting that there's studio presentation from MediaCity in Salford too. ISTR that the BBC used a London virtual studio for 1998, can't remember if they also did in 2002.
Running a single camera for roaming and chatting is far more flexible than having to run a single camera in a studio setup (particularly if you are doing interviews)
The BBC has traditionally used remote production techniques for the Winter Olympics (as Winter Sports is quite niche here) - Turin/Torino in 2006 had a multi-camera studio cut on-site, but the integration between this studio and the main OBS (if it was OBS then) host feeds and unilateral standup positions done in TC5 in London. (Turin was the first time that the BBC had full uncompressed SDI fibre feeds from site ISTR - with SDTI EVS integration too ?).
Vancouver was single camera roaming, as was Sochi, and both were integrated back in the UK 'remote production' style.
NG
But why not just show the game on BBC2 in the first place? That's what many European broadcasters do -- they show all sports events on their second (or third) channels so they don't interfere with the scheduled news programming on their first channel. After all, with digital TV, everyone who has access to BBC1 also has access to BBC2.
Different countries have different TV cultures. Lots of European PSBs only gained a second channel when they launched digital TV (or in some cases earlier than this, but few single PSBs gained a second channel as early as BBC Two arrived) - so they usually have far less history, and far less of a defined 'character' than BBC Two.
In many cases the second channels also don't really have many of their own 'popular' shows - and it's used for repeats of 1st channel shows, extended parliamentary and similar political coverage, repeats of regional news bulletins nationally etc.
BBC One and BBC Two have existed for far longer as a pair, and have very different audiences (and BBC Two has much higher audiences than some PSB second channels)
Big sporting events 'live' on BBC One, smaller sporting events 'live' on BBC Two. People may not see the logic in this, but it's a fact of life. It's nothing to do with universal access.
noggin
Founding member
BBC News Channel Presentation - 21/03/16 onwards
It's pretty simple really. BBC were never going to move the FA Cup conclusion to BBC2 and the news was always going to follow the conclusion of the football.
The news channel comes last in the BBC's list of priorities which is fair enough. BBC want their flagship news show on BBC1 and don't want to annoy people by moving the end of the football to another channel. Whereas in the grand scheme of things delaying the Papers by 45 minutes isn't the end of the world.
The news channel comes last in the BBC's list of priorities which is fair enough. BBC want their flagship news show on BBC1 and don't want to annoy people by moving the end of the football to another channel. Whereas in the grand scheme of things delaying the Papers by 45 minutes isn't the end of the world.
But why not just show the game on BBC2 in the first place? That's what many European broadcasters do -- they show all sports events on their second (or third) channels so they don't interfere with the scheduled news programming on their first channel. After all, with digital TV, everyone who has access to BBC1 also has access to BBC2.
Different countries have different TV cultures. Lots of European PSBs only gained a second channel when they launched digital TV (or in some cases earlier than this, but few single PSBs gained a second channel as early as BBC Two arrived) - so they usually have far less history, and far less of a defined 'character' than BBC Two.
In many cases the second channels also don't really have many of their own 'popular' shows - and it's used for repeats of 1st channel shows, extended parliamentary and similar political coverage, repeats of regional news bulletins nationally etc.
BBC One and BBC Two have existed for far longer as a pair, and have very different audiences (and BBC Two has much higher audiences than some PSB second channels)
Big sporting events 'live' on BBC One, smaller sporting events 'live' on BBC Two. People may not see the logic in this, but it's a fact of life. It's nothing to do with universal access.
NG
Who knows - could be any number of reasons from upgrades to equipment, maintenance of production studios, scheduled air conditioning or power testing work in a studio or building without a backup - no idea...
B: how is it possible it can send that loop?
Maintenance on a studio or gallery, or even an entire building, doesn't preclude broadcasting something later in the broadcast chain, either from a network playout/presentation area, or downstream via a router etc.
noggin
Founding member
Russia Today
WELL how did this get past people? RT news is off for Scheduled Maintenance from 9pm - 7am GMT ?
A; Why
A; Why
Who knows - could be any number of reasons from upgrades to equipment, maintenance of production studios, scheduled air conditioning or power testing work in a studio or building without a backup - no idea...
Quote:
B: how is it possible it can send that loop?
Maintenance on a studio or gallery, or even an entire building, doesn't preclude broadcasting something later in the broadcast chain, either from a network playout/presentation area, or downstream via a router etc.
NG
Why is there a retro looking Sky logo in the corner? I thought all the foreign ones were using the UK Sky logo now?
Sky NZ has no relation to the UK Sky operation.
Yep - Sky NZ has always been very different (it was originally a scrambled analogue UHF over-the-air service like Canal+ in France or BBC Select overnight in the early 90s).
It was part-owned by News Corp at one point (hence the use of similar product branding like Sky+ and Sky Go for some of their platform) but AIUI News Corp sold their holdings a while ago, and so I guess they no longer share branding (if they ever did).
noggin
Founding member
The Sport Thread
Let's have a look...
Oooh, those are nasty!
Oooh, those are nasty!
Why is there a retro looking Sky logo in the corner? I thought all the foreign ones were using the UK Sky logo now?
Sky NZ has no relation to the UK Sky operation.
Yep - Sky NZ has always been very different (it was originally a scrambled analogue UHF over-the-air service like Canal+ in France or BBC Select overnight in the early 90s).
It was part-owned by News Corp at one point (hence the use of similar product branding like Sky+ and Sky Go for some of their platform) but AIUI News Corp sold their holdings a while ago, and so I guess they no longer share branding (if they ever did).
NG
noggin
Founding member
Above and beyond: Keeping TV and radio services on air
Sorry - I keep forgetting about the SDN mux being a COM but not owned by Arqiva. It's a bit of an oddity.
NG
AR - not VR
(It's augmented not virtual)
noggin
Founding member
BBC News Channel Presentation - 21/03/16 onwards
Told you, VR.
AR - not VR
(It's augmented not virtual)
NG
Not sure your point about fibred?
The 27.5W is a backup for the BBC operated Freeview muxes (PSB1 and PSB3). As BBC News HD isn't on PSB3 - it wouldn't be on the 27.5W backup.
(It's on one of the two HD COM muxes - it was COM7 but I think there is a shuffling happening between 7 and 8 )
I don't know what D3/4 who operate (or operated) PSB2 do for their resilience, nor do I know what Arqiva do for COM4-8.
noggin
Founding member
Above and beyond: Keeping TV and radio services on air
Thanks noggin I am guessing the stuff on 28.2e must be fibered there’s no bbc News hd on 27.5w just the SD version.
Not sure your point about fibred?
The 27.5W is a backup for the BBC operated Freeview muxes (PSB1 and PSB3). As BBC News HD isn't on PSB3 - it wouldn't be on the 27.5W backup.
(It's on one of the two HD COM muxes - it was COM7 but I think there is a shuffling happening between 7 and 8 )
I don't know what D3/4 who operate (or operated) PSB2 do for their resilience, nor do I know what Arqiva do for COM4-8.
NG
Trails made by the BBC Creative team (who replaced Red Bee for trail production I think) are still being played out (not sure about production) in SD.
Bumpers made by the shows themselves and delivered to playout close to transmission (or played out by the teams themselves) will be in HD. (Question Time, The One Show, Watchdog, Springwatch etc. all make their own 'on-the-day' bumpers and deliver them in HD, and they are usually played out in HD)
Except in NI, where all locally produced trails have been HD for the past 5 years.
Are the locally produced NI trails made by 'BBC Creative' then?
noggin
Founding member
Presfax closes
On another note, sort of related to the Presfax/Playout changes - the Trails on BBC1 still seem to be in SD, except the Oneness bumpers and a QT trail a bit earlier. Are they not making Trails in HD yet?
Trails made by the BBC Creative team (who replaced Red Bee for trail production I think) are still being played out (not sure about production) in SD.
Bumpers made by the shows themselves and delivered to playout close to transmission (or played out by the teams themselves) will be in HD. (Question Time, The One Show, Watchdog, Springwatch etc. all make their own 'on-the-day' bumpers and deliver them in HD, and they are usually played out in HD)
Except in NI, where all locally produced trails have been HD for the past 5 years.
Are the locally produced NI trails made by 'BBC Creative' then?