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Unique simulcast on TV channels tonight

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CO
cobbles
Jonwo posted:


Why not? As formulas go many of them aren't a million miles away from continuing drama, out paying them over their YouTube revenue would often be cheaper than creating a new programme, and the content is in many case family friendly entertainment. It's perfect television, taps into a younger audience and brings costs down.


What works on YouTube isn't the same as what works on television.


Of course they aren't one and the same but the reality is there is a potential crossover here. A lot of parents have difficulty separating family friendly youtubers for a game for their children to watch - if it's on C4 or BBC2 at 5.30pm-6.00pm - you can pretty much guarantee it being family friendly. Or at least the channels, if there unwilling to straight up show YouTube playthroughs/video game series could be to create panels with these youtubers on the games they play. There's a pretty big subset of server-based gameplay series on YouTube that when all is boiled down are essentially modern versions of soap operas.

The suggestion of long form tik tok is pretty disparaging to the thousands of YouTube who make high effort gaming content and long form series in open-world games etc.
JA
JAS84 Yorkshire Look North (E.Yorks & Lincs)
Why would it have a UTV logo? There's not a channel called UTV any more. Unlike Wales and Scotland there was no need to make a special version as there's no other broadcaster in NI

Yeah, UTV uses the standard ITV pres now, the UTV logo only appears on screen on UTV Live and UTV Life and I'm guessing those programmes will be renamed eventually. It's like how HTV News continued for a couple of years after the England and Wales regions ditched the local branding in 2002. HTV News was only renamed when the generic news titles launched in 2004. It'll probably be the same for UTV, when ITV News rebrands, UTV Live will be renamed.
TI
TIGHazard Tyne Tees Look North (North East)
Jonwo posted:


Why not? As formulas go many of them aren't a million miles away from continuing drama, out paying them over their YouTube revenue would often be cheaper than creating a new programme, and the content is in many case family friendly entertainment. It's perfect television, taps into a younger audience and brings costs down.


What works on YouTube isn't the same as what works on television.


Of course they aren't one and the same but the reality is there is a potential crossover here. A lot of parents have difficulty separating family friendly youtubers for a game for their children to watch - if it's on C4 or BBC2 at 5.30pm-6.00pm - you can pretty much guarantee it being family friendly. Or at least the channels, if there unwilling to straight up show YouTube playthroughs/video game series could be to create panels with these youtubers on the games they play. There's a pretty big subset of server-based gameplay series on YouTube that when all is boiled down are essentially modern versions of soap operas.

The suggestion of long form tik tok is pretty disparaging to the thousands of YouTube who make high effort gaming content and long form series in open-world games etc.


This won't happen for at least two reasons

a) Most of these things involve modifications to the games of some kind and the studios won't want to be involved with that because of liability reasons. You could easily make a soap opera using the sims. Most of the youtubers use a mod that enables teenage pregnancy. It's a storyline done in all our soaps. But the game doesn't naturally allow that, and EA wash their hands of the whole thing because of the games age rating - you can't even talk about it on their own forums.

So either EA will get involved in the show and no mods will be involved, or they won't allow the show to air with any game branding allowed.

b) The internet is international. Say you have a channel that gets 5 million views a video. What percentage of that is a British audience? 25% 50%? Is this content on BBC2/C4 exclusive to the UK audience, or is it also going on youtube but then blocked for UK viewers? What about copyright? Pretty much all content is uploaded to youtube's copyright system. There was an episode of Family Guy where they took footage from an old video game on youtube and dubbed voices over it. That then got uploaded to youtube's copyright system where youtube then removed footage of the game from youtube, because the videos were "ripping off family guy".

Is the youtube copyright system smart enough to work out that not all minecraft footage is the same? It already has issues with game cutscenes and thinking they're trailers.

There's also legal stuff - officially Microsoft doesn't allow you to make money from their games unless they allow you.

Microsoft Content Rules posted:


"Except as described here, you can't sell or otherwise earn any compensation from your Item, including through advertisements in the Item. This means you can't charge money in exchange for your Item, post it on a site that requires subscription or other fees to view the Item, or post it on a page you use to sell other items or services(even if they have nothing to do with Game Content or Microsoft). You also can't use Game Content in an app that you sell in an app store."

"Where someone is trying to use Game Content to promote their commercial venture (even just a commercial website), they need our permission to do this. That is not allowed today unless that person has a commercial license from us, and so far, we haven't given anyone permission to do this. We'll let you know if we do."

"You cannot enter into any agreement with someone else to exclusively distribute your Item even if they don't pay you. We give you this license so that you can make cool Items and share them far and wide. Someone else holding your Item back from wide distribution means: (a) it's not going far and wide; and (b) it is very likely that person is trying to use the Game Content to promote their commercial venture. That's not what these Rules are about."

Last edited by TIGHazard on 9 July 2020 12:49pm
RD
RDJ Central (West) Midlands Today
Let's not go down the path of a UTV Live rename again. That's been cropping up countless times on this forum.

ITV continuity I'd say is likely to stay now, but let's wait until official confirmation until we hedge any bets. But UTV Live will likely stay as UTV Live, but maybe dropping the UTV logo possibly when News gets its next refresh.

Remember that it's still 'ITV News on Channel Television'. ITV would be foolhardy to get rid of legacy names for no real reason when regional news rates well and it's familiar to the viewers it serves.
Central News South January 9th 1989 - December 3rd 2006
AM
AlfieMulcahy Meridian (South East) South East Today
RDJ posted:
Let's not go down the path of a UTV Live rename again. That's been cropping up countless times on this forum.

ITV continuity I'd say is likely to stay now, but let's wait until official confirmation until we hedge any bets. But UTV Live will likely stay as UTV Live, but maybe dropping the UTV logo possibly when News gets its next refresh.

Remember that it's still 'ITV News on Channel Television'. ITV would be foolhardy to get rid of legacy names for no real reason when regional news rates well and it's familiar to the viewers it serves.


Completely agree
Hello, I'm using WhatsApp
CO
cobbles
Jonwo posted:

What works on YouTube isn't the same as what works on television.


Of course they aren't one and the same but the reality is there is a potential crossover here. A lot of parents have difficulty separating family friendly youtubers for a game for their children to watch - if it's on C4 or BBC2 at 5.30pm-6.00pm - you can pretty much guarantee it being family friendly. Or at least the channels, if there unwilling to straight up show YouTube playthroughs/video game series could be to create panels with these youtubers on the games they play. There's a pretty big subset of server-based gameplay series on YouTube that when all is boiled down are essentially modern versions of soap operas.

The suggestion of long form tik tok is pretty disparaging to the thousands of YouTube who make high effort gaming content and long form series in open-world games etc.


This won't happen for at least two reasons

a) Most of these things involve modifications to the games of some kind and the studios won't want to be involved with that because of liability reasons. You could easily make a soap opera using the sims. Most of the youtubers use a mod that enables teenage pregnancy. It's a storyline done in all our soaps. But the game doesn't naturally allow that, and EA wash their hands of the whole thing because of the games age rating - you can't even talk about it on their own forums.

So either EA will get involved in the show and no mods will be involved, or they won't allow the show to air with any game branding allowed.


b) The internet is international. Say you have a channel that gets 5 million views a video. What percentage of that is a British audience? 25% 50%? Is this content on BBC2/C4 exclusive to the UK audience, or is it also going on youtube but then blocked for UK viewers? What about copyright? Pretty much all content is uploaded to youtube's copyright system. There was an episode of Family Guy where they took footage from an old video game on youtube and dubbed voices over it. That then got uploaded to youtube's copyright system where youtube then removed footage of the game from youtube, because the videos were "ripping off family guy".
[/b]
Is the youtube copyright system smart enough to work out that not all minecraft footage is the same? It already has issues with game cutscenes and thinking they're trailers.


I mean it's not likely but as far as idea to innovate the early evening schedule with family friendly content goes it's not the most ridiculous.

To answer both points. I suppose you either go one of two ways - you commission the youtuber to make TV exclusive content and get sanctioning from the game creator, obviously this is better in some scenarios than others (you'd imagine minecraft would say 'don't use the weed mod' but 99% of youtubers don't anyway) or it gets uploaded to the TV Channel's youtube account to circumvent the TV-copyright minefield rather than the youtubers own account. A lot of lower level youtubers don't make much more than anyone in a normal job, meanwhile the cost of producing a TV show is astronomically higher than that - there's a middle ground where a traditional TV channel could pay a youtuber enough to entice them across and get regularly programming that's much cheaper to make than even day-time TV in early evening. Obviously finding a YouTuber with wide enough appeal, playing a game with wide enough appeal who'd still benefit from such an arrangement and be willing to give up their flexibility to upload a day late and no-one bat an eyelid would be difficult but not impossible.

Obviously some games are far more open to the community usage of in-game footage than others, so it would need to be targeted carefully on that score as well. I totally understand that this is probably not going to happen, but I honestly thing it's something that's not as ridiculous as many on here think.

The alternative is of course to essentially run a gaming version of the gadget show that brings together a group of top-video gaming youtubers to discuss games and the content their putting out over the next month or so every so often, but that seems even less likely.

Re - the Microsoft rules - until this gets tested in court the entire online video game industry has problem - as you cited Minecraft here's the EULA from Mojang themselves which until we get legal definitions of fair use leaves us in a situation where if someone really wanted to do so they could attempt to shut-down the YouTuber industry as you insinuate - I really think for the sake of the industry these 'fair use' rules need clearer legal definition or to be court tested - this is one of the clearest you'll find - ads are okay on Minecraft videos - most games don't have that in their EULA.....

The question is whether server-play like Hermitcraft is technically commercial usage through branding of the game, yes they're allowed to put ads on the videos, but the extent to which they've built a brand around Minecraft could technically be in contravention of the EULA, I'd hate to see it tested cos I love groups like that but if it was it could be kapoosh for them and many like them.

Quote:
Within reason you're free to do whatever you want with screenshots and videos of the Game. By "within reason" we mean that you can't make any commercial use of them or do things that are unfair or adversely affect our rights unless we've specifically said it's okay in this EULA, allowed it through the Brand and Asset Usage Guidelines, or provided for it in a specific agreement with you. If you upload videos of the game to video sharing and streaming sites you are however allowed to put ads on them . Also, don't just rip art resources and pass them around, that's no fun.

Essentially the simple rule is do not make commercial use of anything we've made unless we've specifically said it's okay. Oh and if the law expressly allows it, such as under a "fair use" or fair dealing" doctrine then that's ok too - but only to the extent that the law applicable to you says so.
Last edited by cobbles on 9 July 2020 1:04pm
LN
LondonNewsBites London London

Of course they aren't one and the same but the reality is there is a potential crossover here. A lot of parents have difficulty separating family friendly youtubers for a game for their children to watch - if it's on C4 or BBC2 at 5.30pm-6.00pm - you can pretty much guarantee it being family friendly. Or at least the channels, if there unwilling to straight up show YouTube playthroughs/video game series could be to create panels with these youtubers on the games they play. There's a pretty big subset of server-based gameplay series on YouTube that when all is boiled down are essentially modern versions of soap operas.

The suggestion of long form tik tok is pretty disparaging to the thousands of YouTube who make high effort gaming content and long form series in open-world games etc.


This won't happen for at least two reasons

a) Most of these things involve modifications to the games of some kind and the studios won't want to be involved with that because of liability reasons. You could easily make a soap opera using the sims. Most of the youtubers use a mod that enables teenage pregnancy. It's a storyline done in all our soaps. But the game doesn't naturally allow that, and EA wash their hands of the whole thing because of the games age rating - you can't even talk about it on their own forums.

So either EA will get involved in the show and no mods will be involved, or they won't allow the show to air with any game branding allowed.


b) The internet is international. Say you have a channel that gets 5 million views a video. What percentage of that is a British audience? 25% 50%? Is this content on BBC2/C4 exclusive to the UK audience, or is it also going on youtube but then blocked for UK viewers? What about copyright? Pretty much all content is uploaded to youtube's copyright system. There was an episode of Family Guy where they took footage from an old video game on youtube and dubbed voices over it. That then got uploaded to youtube's copyright system where youtube then removed footage of the game from youtube, because the videos were "ripping off family guy".
[/b]
Is the youtube copyright system smart enough to work out that not all minecraft footage is the same? It already has issues with game cutscenes and thinking they're trailers.


I mean it's not likely but as far as idea to innovate the early evening schedule with family friendly content goes it's not the most ridiculous.

To answer both points. I suppose you either go one of two ways - you commission the youtuber to make TV exclusive content and get sanctioning from the game creator, obviously this is better in some scenarios than others (you'd imagine minecraft would say 'don't use the weed mod' but 99% of youtubers don't anyway) or it gets uploaded to the TV Channel's youtube account to circumvent the TV-copyright minefield rather than the youtubers own account. A lot of lower level youtubers don't make much more than anyone in a normal job, meanwhile the cost of producing a TV show is astronomically higher than that - there's a middle ground where a traditional TV channel could pay a youtuber enough to entice them across and get regularly programming that's much cheaper to make than even day-time TV in early evening. Obviously finding a YouTuber with wide enough appeal, playing a game with wide enough appeal who'd still benefit from such an arrangement and be willing to give up their flexibility to upload a day late and no-one bat an eyelid would be difficult but not impossible.

Obviously some games are far more open to the community usage of in-game footage than others, so it would need to be targeted carefully on that score as well. I totally understand that this is probably not going to happen, but I honestly thing it's something that's not as ridiculous as many on here think.

The alternative is of course to essentially run a gaming version of the gadget show that brings together a group of top-video gaming youtubers to discuss games and the content their putting out over the next month or so every so often, but that seems even less likely.

Re - the Microsoft rules - until this gets tested in court the entire online video game industry has problem - as you cited Minecraft here's the EULA from Mojang themselves which until we get legal definitions of fair use leaves us in a situation where if someone really wanted to do so they could attempt to shut-down the YouTuber industry as you insinuate - I really think for the sake of the industry these 'fair use' rules need clearer legal definition or to be court tested - this is one of the clearest you'll find - ads are okay on Minecraft videos - most games don't have that in their EULA.....

The question is whether server-play like Hermitcraft is technically commercial usage through branding of the game, yes they're allowed to put ads on the videos, but the extent to which they've built a brand around Minecraft could technically be in contravention of the EULA, I'd hate to see it tested cos I love groups like that but if it was it could be kapoosh for them and many like them.

Quote:
Within reason you're free to do whatever you want with screenshots and videos of the Game. By "within reason" we mean that you can't make any commercial use of them or do things that are unfair or adversely affect our rights unless we've specifically said it's okay in this EULA, allowed it through the Brand and Asset Usage Guidelines, or provided for it in a specific agreement with you. If you upload videos of the game to video sharing and streaming sites you are however allowed to put ads on them . Also, don't just rip art resources and pass them around, that's no fun.

Essentially the simple rule is do not make commercial use of anything we've made unless we've specifically said it's okay. Oh and if the law expressly allows it, such as under a "fair use" or fair dealing" doctrine then that's ok too - but only to the extent that the law applicable to you says so.


And HOW would it suit BBC Two/C4?

It looks more suited for CBBC tbh.
Its a good show!
JO
Josh
Does anyone know the music used in the promo? I quite like it.
Fan of the media industry, from the UK.
NJ
Neil Jones Founding member Central (West) Midlands Today
Josh posted:
Does anyone know the music used in the promo? I quite like it.




You're welcome. Though the answer to your question was in the comments on the YouTube video posted on the BBC YouTube page... Smile
CO
cobbles

This won't happen for at least two reasons

a) Most of these things involve modifications to the games of some kind and the studios won't want to be involved with that because of liability reasons. You could easily make a soap opera using the sims. Most of the youtubers use a mod that enables teenage pregnancy. It's a storyline done in all our soaps. But the game doesn't naturally allow that, and EA wash their hands of the whole thing because of the games age rating - you can't even talk about it on their own forums.

So either EA will get involved in the show and no mods will be involved, or they won't allow the show to air with any game branding allowed.


b) The internet is international. Say you have a channel that gets 5 million views a video. What percentage of that is a British audience? 25% 50%? Is this content on BBC2/C4 exclusive to the UK audience, or is it also going on youtube but then blocked for UK viewers? What about copyright? Pretty much all content is uploaded to youtube's copyright system. There was an episode of Family Guy where they took footage from an old video game on youtube and dubbed voices over it. That then got uploaded to youtube's copyright system where youtube then removed footage of the game from youtube, because the videos were "ripping off family guy".
[/b]
Is the youtube copyright system smart enough to work out that not all minecraft footage is the same? It already has issues with game cutscenes and thinking they're trailers.


I mean it's not likely but as far as idea to innovate the early evening schedule with family friendly content goes it's not the most ridiculous.

To answer both points. I suppose you either go one of two ways - you commission the youtuber to make TV exclusive content and get sanctioning from the game creator, obviously this is better in some scenarios than others (you'd imagine minecraft would say 'don't use the weed mod' but 99% of youtubers don't anyway) or it gets uploaded to the TV Channel's youtube account to circumvent the TV-copyright minefield rather than the youtubers own account. A lot of lower level youtubers don't make much more than anyone in a normal job, meanwhile the cost of producing a TV show is astronomically higher than that - there's a middle ground where a traditional TV channel could pay a youtuber enough to entice them across and get regularly programming that's much cheaper to make than even day-time TV in early evening. Obviously finding a YouTuber with wide enough appeal, playing a game with wide enough appeal who'd still benefit from such an arrangement and be willing to give up their flexibility to upload a day late and no-one bat an eyelid would be difficult but not impossible.

Obviously some games are far more open to the community usage of in-game footage than others, so it would need to be targeted carefully on that score as well. I totally understand that this is probably not going to happen, but I honestly thing it's something that's not as ridiculous as many on here think.

The alternative is of course to essentially run a gaming version of the gadget show that brings together a group of top-video gaming youtubers to discuss games and the content their putting out over the next month or so every so often, but that seems even less likely.

Re - the Microsoft rules - until this gets tested in court the entire online video game industry has problem - as you cited Minecraft here's the EULA from Mojang themselves which until we get legal definitions of fair use leaves us in a situation where if someone really wanted to do so they could attempt to shut-down the YouTuber industry as you insinuate - I really think for the sake of the industry these 'fair use' rules need clearer legal definition or to be court tested - this is one of the clearest you'll find - ads are okay on Minecraft videos - most games don't have that in their EULA.....

The question is whether server-play like Hermitcraft is technically commercial usage through branding of the game, yes they're allowed to put ads on the videos, but the extent to which they've built a brand around Minecraft could technically be in contravention of the EULA, I'd hate to see it tested cos I love groups like that but if it was it could be kapoosh for them and many like them.

Quote:
Within reason you're free to do whatever you want with screenshots and videos of the Game. By "within reason" we mean that you can't make any commercial use of them or do things that are unfair or adversely affect our rights unless we've specifically said it's okay in this EULA, allowed it through the Brand and Asset Usage Guidelines, or provided for it in a specific agreement with you. If you upload videos of the game to video sharing and streaming sites you are however allowed to put ads on them . Also, don't just rip art resources and pass them around, that's no fun.

Essentially the simple rule is do not make commercial use of anything we've made unless we've specifically said it's okay. Oh and if the law expressly allows it, such as under a "fair use" or fair dealing" doctrine then that's ok too - but only to the extent that the law applicable to you says so.


And HOW would it suit BBC Two/C4?

It looks more suited for CBBC tbh.


Are you being deliberately obtuse.

Adults play video games and watch YouTubers who do. 'Family friendly' doesn't mean for kids.

It would suit both channels in that it's a current pro uct tapping into some of the most popular industries right now.
IS
Inspector Sands
There'd be no copyright issues putting games on TV because as you say they'd have to go about it with the sanction of the company who made it.

But really it's not going to happen. Not only is it a very niche audience, why would they tune in to linear TV at 6pm to watch a certain game being played when there's a choice of hundreds online to watch on demand?

TV has tried the idea of showing or featuring computer games and it never works. The excitement that the person playing it is getting never translates to the audience. It's all down to mode of address. YouTube games videos, like a lot of online content are a very personal thing, not made for an audience. You get one person sitting in front of their PC or watching on their phone but not a group of people sitting round watching them. That's not what TV wants, it's also one of the reasons many podcasts don't work on radio, they're a much more personal medium


Videos of people opening boxes of toys get millions of hits, tha doesn't mean they would work on TV
Last edited by Inspector Sands on 10 July 2020 8:51am
SP
Steve in Pudsey Yorkshire Look North (Yorkshire)
I'm going to slightly disagree with that in saying that the Virtual F1 that Sky were showing while they had nothing else seemed to be reasonably well received. But that may have been due to the circumstances more than anything.

The e-sports sub genre is probably more suitable for TV than other formats.

Having said that, I reckon there's a gameshow format in Tetris with physical pieces.
Write that down in your copybook now.

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