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Channel 4 pre-1993 regional opt outs

Split from Favourite TV Breakdowns (April 2019)

SP
Steve in Pudsey Yorkshire Look North (Yorkshire)
I can't see any major technical barrier to putting a live source on air rather than adverts from VT. I think we've established that the C4 suites tended to be mini versions of the main ITV suite, so even if taking a different source required some creative replugging it was certainly possible.
Write that down in your copybook now.
IS
Inspector Sands
TLS existed in 1993?

Yes it spun off ad a seperate resources company in the late 80s. LWT also spun off its production arm as LWT Productions around the same time. All part of getting the company ready for the franchise round. It wasn't initially branded TLS:
https://youtu.be/JAuQg1Jr2fE


Thames and Central did the same to their studios in Teddington and Nottingham around that time too
HC
Hatton Cross Central (West) Midlands Today
Wasn't The London Studios it's second 'spun off from LWT name'

IIRC it's first name I remember seeing listed on programme credits was 'The London Television Centre' until one assumes the enviable confusion with the other one in W12 cause a rename..
Readers are warned that this post contains some flash photography
IS
Inspector Sands
'London Television Centre' is the name of the building.

It was used in addresses of the organisations based there, one of which was a company called The London Studios. I suppose once it stopped being just LWT (I know there were some non TV businesses in there from the start) the name was needed to distinguish the company from the building


The London Studios was what everyone called the building towards the end though. However the London Television Centre is still the official name:
https://www.london.gov.uk/what-we-do/planning/planning-applications-and-decisions/planning-application-search/london-television-centre
Last edited by Inspector Sands on 11 May 2019 7:44am
MA
Markymark Meridian (Thames Valley) South Today
TLS did exist back then, it was the studios of LWT, the south bank studios.

As an aside to this, the regional set up for adverts in the 1980s on C4, could that have, if needed, have allowed for regional opt outs for something else, such as a news report on something that was more of regional interest as opposed to national interest? I know C4 did broadcast a Scotland soccer match one morning, during TV-am airtime on ITV, on behalf of STV, but I think that was networked.


It was networked, but as it didn’t displace anything other than the test card, it made sence to network it.

That said, I’m not sure the charter ( for want of a better word) of C4 allowed regional opts ( beyond ultilty programming such as schools and PPBs) Also I can’t remember whether the programme included ads, I suspect if it had there would have been some sort of financial arrangement with TV-am ?
GE
thegeek Founding member London London
I know C4 did broadcast a Scotland soccer match one morning, during TV-am airtime on ITV, on behalf of STV, but I think that was networked.

Wait what? Was that sort of thing a bit of an exception at the time, or did C4 regularly end up as an overspill for ITV channels?
BL
bluecortina
Wasn't The London Studios it's second 'spun off from LWT name'

IIRC it's first name I remember seeing listed on programme credits was 'The London Television Centre' until one assumes the enviable confusion with the other one in W12 cause a rename..


When LWT decided to spin off the production facilities side of the business, although it remained a wholly owned subsidiary, the chosen name was ‘LWT Production facilities’. After a while it was felt that name was putting off potential customers because of the obvious LWT connection, so, the name was changed to ‘The London Studios’ often shortened to the familiar TLS.
BL
bluecortina

LNN had no involvement with C4 - this was handled by TLS facility-wise. It was a long time ago and my memory not so clear after all this time, but I see no technical reason for the usual LWT/C4 ad inject system not to work as it always had until C4 ‘took it back’

Indeed, as I said a few pages back
Quote:
Why do you think LNN had any involvement with C4? Perhaps you were not aware that all lines into and out of South Bank went via the TLS area? - even those into and out of LNN.

LNN were rehearsing in their new transmission suite a couple of months, maybe 3, before taking over their official transmission duties on behalf of LWT/Carlton and GMTV. They did not take over any staff from TLS, although TLS staff were welcome to apply to join LNN if they wished - it was their individual choices - LNN was a completely separate company from LWT and Carlton. So, LNN came on-air at midnight 1/1/1993, they did not take over LWT’s transmissions before that date and I’m not sure why you might think they would? By this stage LWT’s transmission was coming from the ex-original C4 transmission suite and was completely self contained and separate from LNN.

Ahhh, right. I had assumed that LNN was just some bits of LWT that were spun off into a new jointly owned company, after all a lot of the staff and on screen talent of LNN were ex LWT. I also assumed that they just upgraded the existing transmission areas and used them for LNN rather than build a completely new one.


If both those were the case then of course they'd have to have been LNN involvement before 1993 as it would have had to have been operational a while before, as it was for piloting


The new transmission suite was part of LWT’s licence application, they offered to share it with whoever got the weekday licence if it could be agreed. As we know Carlton won and accepted LWT’s offer. TLS offered to build and operate the new facility but Carlton were having none of that, they didn’t want their ‘actual’ transmissions to be handled by an LWT subsidiary - loss of face/kudos etc. So LWT and Carlton set up a joint company known as the JVOC (and it was known by that name for quite some time) until a long time later when the JVOC was fully up and running with its own senior management etc and decided what their name would be - LNN. Bit of an odd name for a transmission facility, but of course it suited the news operation. LNN was jointly owned on a 50/50 basis but not funded on that basis for obvious reasons. Obviously too the original design and implementation of the tx suite was adapted by TLS and LNN’s staff as the parameters were altered to meet a much more sophisticated brief than the original one (GMTV etc).
Last edited by bluecortina on 11 May 2019 11:28am
Markymark, Inspector Sands and nwtv2003 gave kudos
BL
bluecortina
In 1982 nobody really knew what C4 was going to be all about, probably not even Channel 4 fully. I think thats why some ITV companies built quite complex C4 commercial injection points capable of much more that, in the end, weren’t really needed. That’s my take anyway.
Si-Co, Markymark and TedJrr gave kudos
NW
nwtv2003 Granada North West Today
I know C4 did broadcast a Scotland soccer match one morning, during TV-am airtime on ITV, on behalf of STV, but I think that was networked.

Wait what? Was that sort of thing a bit of an exception at the time, or did C4 regularly end up as an overspill for ITV channels?


The match in question was Australia Vs Scotland, as such the kick off was 9:00am on a Wednesday, which ITV had the rights to, but was a bit of a logistical nightmare. Apparently it was also a normal Schools day for ITV too. I’m not too sure on the ins and outs but the match ended up being shown on Channel 4.

Without taking the thread too off topic it wasn’t too uncommon for the likes of Snooker, Athletics and Horse Racing to be shown on Channel 4 in its early years whilst being produced by ITV Sport. It was documented somewhere that Jeremy Issacs loathed the Snooker being shown on Channel 4.
steve
steviegTVreturns
MA
Markymark Meridian (Thames Valley) South Today
I know C4 did broadcast a Scotland soccer match one morning, during TV-am airtime on ITV, on behalf of STV, but I think that was networked.

Wait what? Was that sort of thing a bit of an exception at the time, or did C4 regularly end up as an overspill for ITV channels?


In the very early days, in an attempt to boost C4’s ratings, there was a Thursday evening where the two channels swapped programmes.
MC
mccanmat London London
I know C4 did broadcast a Scotland soccer match one morning, during TV-am airtime on ITV, on behalf of STV, but I think that was networked.

Wait what? Was that sort of thing a bit of an exception at the time, or did C4 regularly end up as an overspill for ITV channels?


The match in question was Australia Vs Scotland, as such the kick off was 9:00am on a Wednesday, which ITV had the rights to, but was a bit of a logistical nightmare. Apparently it was also a normal Schools day for ITV too. I’m not too sure on the ins and outs but the match ended up being shown on Channel 4.

Without taking the thread too off topic it wasn’t too uncommon for the likes of Snooker, Athletics and Horse Racing to be shown on Channel 4 in its early years whilst being produced by ITV Sport. It was documented somewhere that Jeremy Issacs loathed the Snooker being shown on Channel 4.


I remember the athletics switching between the two... and the 1988 olympics being shared between itv and c4

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