Mass Media & Technology

Off Air Broadcast Feeds

Is there a way to access Off Air Feeds from UK Live Shows? (June 2018)

GE
thegeek Founding member London London
Depends on the show as previously discussed, Springwatch was recently on 23.5e unencrypted and had the directors audio on one of the feeds


A previous year's Springwatch had director's talkback embedded on one of the audio tracks, to get it back to one of their contribution OBs. A certain model of model of Freeview receiver ignored the fact that there was no control track, and mixed it in to the programme as if it were Audio Description. It just so happened that a friend of the production team had that model of receiver (and AD turned on), so it got fed back and fixed pretty sharpish!
bilky asko and UKnews gave kudos
LB
Luke B (previously Lukeyboy) Meridian (South East) South East Today
Depends on the show as previously discussed, Springwatch was recently on 23.5e unencrypted and had the directors audio on one of the feeds


A previous year's Springwatch had director's talkback embedded on one of the audio tracks, to get it back to one of their contribution OBs. A certain model of model of Freeview receiver ignored the fact that there was no control track, and mixed it in to the programme as if it were Audio Description. It just so happened that a friend of the production team had that model of receiver (and AD turned on), so it got fed back and fixed pretty sharpish!


Has anyone managed to capture a feed of Springwatch with talkback included as mentioned? I would love to view a copy if someone has it.
XQ
XQD (previously LCL92) London London
For those interested, here are some technical schematics that show the way transmission chains work for live programmes.

Here's one for Good Morning Britain when it came from the Southbank. I have blurred certain sensitive information out:

*

And for programmes that use satellite as their TX path, the below is from The BRITs a few years ago:

*

As previously mentioned, most FTA content is unencrypted. If you have a steerable dish and can get access to a feed early in the afternoon on TX Day (i.e BRITS or BGT), you'll probably get a glimpse at the dress rehearsal and some other not-for-public goodies.

I'm working on getting access to a few programmes and sharing the talkback - unfortunately this needs the permission of the gallery, including the director, as well as senior team members such as the exec producer but I hope to bring a glimpse of a live gallery at some point soon.

I believe there are clips of X Factor and BGT from the Fountain days that are circulating online - including talkback gold featuring a very annoyed Jonathan Bullen (the director).
Views are my own and not that of my employer!
LB
Luke B (previously Lukeyboy) Meridian (South East) South East Today
Thank you for all that info LCL92! And I love the look of those schematics!

LCL92 posted:
I'm working on getting access to a few programmes and sharing the talkback


Any hints as to what the programmes may be?
Last edited by Luke B on 21 June 2018 4:17pm
EL
elmarko STV Central Reporting Scotland
That Brits satellite diagram says there's a BISS key - so that was encrypted even though it'd be on FTA?
NG
noggin Founding member
That Brits satellite diagram says there's a BISS key - so that was encrypted even though it'd be on FTA?


Encryption is increasingly common for all shows - whether on a FTA channel or not. This is at least partially to avoid rehearsals being snooped on - and potentially distributed by - those not legally entitled to receive them. In fact it's probably illegal to watch them.

https://www.ofcom.org.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0027/89037/Guidance-on-Receive-Only-Radio-Scanners.pdf

Is for scanners (so tuning into radio talkback is illegal if you don't have permission) but I suspect would equally apply to UK satellite links.

Encryption isn't universal - and is less usual for news uplinks - but isn't that unusual for any UK non-news uplink irrespective of the broadcast outlet.
EL
elmarko STV Central Reporting Scotland
I think you'd be correct with your legal assessment
VM
VMPhil Granada North West Today
I recall reading a story which I can’t find now - maybe I’m not searching the right terms, but I definitely read it online.

The Tonight Show Starring Johnny Carson moved production from 30 Rockefeller Plaza, New York to Burbank, California in 1972. However there were either no editing facilities or limited editing facilities there (I am probably misremembering this part) so for many years the show was still edited in New York with the entire daily recording in the afternoon transmitted live over satellite. In the 80s, C-Band satellite dish enthusiasts discovered these feeds and began sharing notes about what happened and what was said during breaks in the recording. This began to worry Carson and eventually editing was moved permanently to Burbank.
HA
harshy Founding member
That Brits satellite diagram says there's a BISS key - so that was encrypted even though it'd be on FTA?


Encryption is increasingly common for all shows - whether on a FTA channel or not. This is at least partially to avoid rehearsals being snooped on - and potentially distributed by - those not legally entitled to receive them. In fact it's probably illegal to watch them.

https://www.ofcom.org.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0027/89037/Guidance-on-Receive-Only-Radio-Scanners.pdf

Is for scanners (so tuning into radio talkback is illegal if you don't have permission) but I suspect would equally apply to UK satellite links.

Encryption isn't universal - and is less usual for news uplinks - but isn't that unusual for any UK non-news uplink irrespective of the broadcast outlet.


It’s 70/80% crypted now having a big dish is only useful for news feeds and to learn about broadcast video and do analysis on it, all the juicy stuff been crypted for a good 15 years now, of course it’s set to get worse and already has with ns3/4...
GE
thegeek Founding member London London

It’s 70/80% crypted now having a big dish is only useful for news feeds and to learn about broadcast video and do analysis on it, all the juicy stuff been crypted for a good 15 years now, of course it’s set to get worse and already has with ns3/4...
worse for hobbyist scanners, better for rightsholders!
Football leagues and the like probably aren't too keen on details of their matches being shared online, even if it's a bit of a niche market who can watch them.
CO
commseng London London
I'd say a very niche market.
I did once have most of my uplinks discovered by someone posting with the name Stanley Cassidy (I've no reason to doubt that is his real name).
So for one transmission I changed the service name to Hello Stanley.
He didn't find that one of course!
HA
harshy Founding member
That Stanley knows everything he was posting on encrypted feeds since forever.

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